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BM vs MM in raidsFollow

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#52 Sep 10 2007 at 12:50 PM Rating: Decent
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I supose we are thinkin apples and oranges. Everything in my mind is raiding and I forget about 5 mans and heroics and such. Heroics are somethin I do with my alts if/when I'm not raiding and can find the time.

I will say though that it just feels great to run a heroic anything with a nice tight group and have it go smoothly with no wipes. So much less stress than raiding.


Oh god yes!

Raiding I come out with a 29-34g repair bill every night, notcounting the 50+g I spend on pots and crap. Heroics, maybe a 12g repair, and badges, so not too bad. Been through a heroic with a 2g repair bill once, just about pissed in my pants! Sad thing is, I have better luck with PuG in Heroics than I do in Guild. :(

Meh, My Resto Shammy is now 70 so maybe I'll have different there, kinda nice being able to sit back and heal for a change, instead of siting there taing damage wondering if I am going to get a heal, I get to sit there and wonder how long it will be till the Tank realizes, oh **** Im in trouble!
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#53 Sep 10 2007 at 9:28 PM Rating: Default
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Been discussing this with a few bm hunters. and a survival hunter.

The general consensus at the end was.

For doing 5 man heroic or non or 10 man instances. versatility is key. The marksman hunter is a very good role for this type of play. because they offer the versatility to deal with varrying situations in a small party setup.

For a 25 man raid instance, Bm and sv dominate the scene. because the utility of a mm hunter is not needed in them. thus the raw dps and party buff aspect come into play much more.



For pvp all builds have their place.


I dont think any build is useless so i really dont think this convo should exist.

The reason they are in this game.. is because of that point.. if mm or bm or sv was useless it would not be in the game.

Also. Gear wise the bm and survival hunters are much more dependant on to be effiecent.






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#54 Sep 11 2007 at 9:21 AM Rating: Decent
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Thoguh I somewhat agree with what you say there, I would have to argue this point:

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For a 25 man raid instance, Bm and sv dominate the scene. because the utility of a mm hunter is not needed in them. thus the raw dps and party buff aspect come into play much more.


you say the utility of an MM hunter is not needed in 25 mans, yet Raw DPS and party buff's come into play, that is somewhat of a contradiction in terms as MM is defined as pure, unmolested, raw DPS and not much else, as well as the party buff statement (TSA) which is limited strictly to the party as well as BM Furocious Insperation. Both are Party buffs and if put in the right groups, most especcially in 25-mans were you will have 4+ Melee, that would benifit from TSA without having to worry about TSA not affecting casters.

Survival spec is the only spec that would benifit the entire Raid with EW, so if going by what you are stating, in 25-mans Survival Hunters are the only ones that it would benifit the Raid to take along.

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The reason they are in this game.. is because of that point.. if mm or bm or sv was useless it would not be in the game.


I would also have to argue that I have seen plenty of useless things in the game. Like cloth "of the falcon" or "of the monkey" items. WTF? Didn't know casters needed agility...


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And to think, Caldone, I actually had a compliment of sorts for you in my


This reply should be much more to your approval :P

Edited, Sep 11th 2007 10:22am by Caldone
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#55 Sep 12 2007 at 12:21 AM Rating: Decent
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Caldone the Shady wrote:
you say the utility of an MM hunter is not needed in 25 mans, yet Raw DPS and party buff's come into play, that is somewhat of a contradiction in terms as MM is defined as pure, unmolested, raw DPS and not much else, as well as the party buff statement (TSA) which is limited strictly to the party as well as BM Furocious Insperation. Both are Party buffs and if put in the right groups, most especcially in 25-mans were you will have 4+ Melee, that would benifit from TSA without having to worry about TSA not affecting casters.
Wether you agree or not, BM just does more dps then MM and MM has a lot more utility then BM simply because of silencing shot.

And if you are talking about group buffs, TSA is by far the weakest of the 3.

What you said about SV hunters being the only ones suited for raiding would be correct if EW stacked.
Since it doesnt, more then 1 SV hunter is a waste and the others will have to go for the spec with the highest personal dps.
wich is BM because bowspeed is nice to them at this time in raiding and because pets survive now so they get full damage from that.
And FI > TSA simply because there arent many melee dps brought to raids and FI affects everyone.
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#56 Sep 12 2007 at 8:40 AM Rating: Decent
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And FI > TSA simply because there arent many melee dps brought to raids and FI affects everyone.


That I would actually have to Disagree with.

In all the 25-man encounters I have been in there has always been at least 4 Melee DPS of some sort in the raid, Kara, yeah thats different, but I usually get stuck in with the Tank, a Rogue, a DPS Warr, and a Feral Druid. Works out pretty good, Im helping them out and they keep Commanding Shout and Battle Shout up, I love the Health, my pet loves the added AP. Plus I love the added 5% Crit, just about creamed myself when I looked at my Char sheet during Kara and had 35% Crit...
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#57 Sep 12 2007 at 9:17 AM Rating: Good
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Caldone the Shady wrote:
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And FI > TSA simply because there arent many melee dps brought to raids and FI affects everyone.


That I would actually have to Disagree with.

In all the 25-man encounters I have been in there has always been at least 4 Melee DPS of some sort in the raid, Kara, yeah thats different, but I usually get stuck in with the Tank, a Rogue, a DPS Warr, and a Feral Druid. Works out pretty good, Im helping them out and they keep Commanding Shout and Battle Shout up, I love the Health, my pet loves the added AP. Plus I love the added 5% Crit, just about creamed myself when I looked at my Char sheet during Kara and had 35% Crit...


125 AP is 8 DPS and change; in order for Ferocious Inspiration to beat it out, you only need to reach a threshold of a meager 275 DPS, at which point even just one 10 second burst of the 3/3 FI bonus will cause a greater DPS boost.

Not knocking TSA, just sayin'.
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#58 Sep 12 2007 at 9:23 AM Rating: Decent
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Not knocking TSA, just sayin'.


Yeah should have narrowed down what I was referring to, I was reffering to this portion of that quote:

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And FI > TSA simply because there arent many melee dps brought to raids and FI affects everyone.


Wasn't arguing that the buff wasn't week, just the ammount of Melee :P
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