All right, recently picked up Warlock, as well as WoW, and I've noticed many differences from other big MMORPGs, particularly the ability to solo.
Anyway, on to my point - as a Warlock, I plan to grind to 70, and anticipate much solo questing with instances mixed in here and there. My question is, for someone who plans to use their pet frequently for soloing, should I invest my upcoming talents primarily into a demonology tree, with a smaller emphasis on affliction? Perhaps I'll change it once I hit endgame, based on popular consensus and demand, but for now, what is most advisable? I want to be able to efificiently soli using my pets, while still doing solid damage. Looking for any pointers, thanks in advance. ^^
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Talent Tree questionFollow
In my opinion affliction with couple of points in demo (Demonic Embrace) completely rocks for leveling.
I personally had it until 64 when I respecced to full demo, I wanted a pet that can keep aggro when I go trigger happy on SBs.
But I remember that Improved VW wasnt bad at keeping aggro at all if I only payed bit attention.
I personally had it until 64 when I respecced to full demo, I wanted a pet that can keep aggro when I go trigger happy on SBs.
But I remember that Improved VW wasnt bad at keeping aggro at all if I only payed bit attention.
Almost all of my points have been spent in Demonology, with about 11 in Affliction.
As a Warlock, you are always going to use Affliction or Demonology (otherwise, be a mage), so you should have a couple points invested in either, at least-- especially for mastery of Improved Healthstone. The Demonology skill is primary only if you enjoy soloing, because Affliction is better in a group dynamic.
I have no plan on spending points in Destruction, simply because it seems like a waste, so I cant really comment on how that would work out.
As a Warlock, you are always going to use Affliction or Demonology (otherwise, be a mage), so you should have a couple points invested in either, at least-- especially for mastery of Improved Healthstone. The Demonology skill is primary only if you enjoy soloing, because Affliction is better in a group dynamic.
I have no plan on spending points in Destruction, simply because it seems like a waste, so I cant really comment on how that would work out.
sederix wrote:
As a Warlock, you are always going to use Affliction or Demonology (otherwise, be a mage)... I have no plan on spending points in Destruction, simply because it seems like a waste, so I cant really comment on how that would work out.
If you cant comment how that would work, you obviously have no clue about destro then.
Some equally ignorant destro lock could tell you he wouldnt go demo because he would be a hunter.
Shadowburn a waste? Hm...
Quote:
especially for mastery of Improved Healthstone
I never ever had single point in Imp HS and I leveled to 70 like a breeze and am doing fine after that too. Heck I always forget to even make HS if I am not in group doing some instance.
Quote:
The Demonology skill is primary only if you enjoy soloing
Demonology is not a skill, its a build. And before one can get Felguard with all the gadgets I dont find full Demo very solo friendly.
What works or doesnt work in group dynamic in my opinion is how good you are in playing with the build that suits you - that may be called a skill and it doesnt depend on build but on player.
"If you cant comment how that would work, you obviously have no clue about destro then.
Some equally ignorant destro lock could tell you he wouldnt go demo because he would be a hunter.
Shadowburn a waste? Hm..."
Uh what?
I said that I could not comment on Destruction, so what was the point of repeating what I said, as if you were pointing out some flaw in my reasoning? An 'equally ignorant' Destruction warlock would not have the mind to point out that they never bothered with the other two choices, so why would you over-analyze what I just spelled-out?
Hunters dont have spells, and how many hunters can easily re-summon any "pet" they like to match a situation? Do hunters not have only one pet at a time, until they choose to re-train a new one to match their skill level? This is not a very good analogy, because hunters and warlocks are not alike in this way.
This is a quote from the WoW website: "Warlocks are masters of shadow, flame, and demonic power." "Hunters also possess a primal connection to the beasts of Azeroth, capable of taming and training them to keep as loyal guardians." "Mages wield the elements of fire, frost, and the arcane to destroy or neutralize their enemies."
From those descriptions, Warlocks and Mages are more alike than Warlocks and Hunters.
Anyhow, I responded to help someone based on how I chose to play the game, and I clearly stated I was speaking in reference to those choices. So, I dont see where you get off saying that your choices are more valid.
Some equally ignorant destro lock could tell you he wouldnt go demo because he would be a hunter.
Shadowburn a waste? Hm..."
Uh what?
I said that I could not comment on Destruction, so what was the point of repeating what I said, as if you were pointing out some flaw in my reasoning? An 'equally ignorant' Destruction warlock would not have the mind to point out that they never bothered with the other two choices, so why would you over-analyze what I just spelled-out?
Hunters dont have spells, and how many hunters can easily re-summon any "pet" they like to match a situation? Do hunters not have only one pet at a time, until they choose to re-train a new one to match their skill level? This is not a very good analogy, because hunters and warlocks are not alike in this way.
This is a quote from the WoW website: "Warlocks are masters of shadow, flame, and demonic power." "Hunters also possess a primal connection to the beasts of Azeroth, capable of taming and training them to keep as loyal guardians." "Mages wield the elements of fire, frost, and the arcane to destroy or neutralize their enemies."
From those descriptions, Warlocks and Mages are more alike than Warlocks and Hunters.
Anyhow, I responded to help someone based on how I chose to play the game, and I clearly stated I was speaking in reference to those choices. So, I dont see where you get off saying that your choices are more valid.
sederix wrote:
"If you cant comment how that would work, you obviously have no clue about destro then.
Some equally ignorant destro lock could tell you he wouldnt go demo because he would be a hunter.
Shadowburn a waste? Hm..."
Uh what?
I said that I could not comment on Destruction, so what was the point of repeating what I said, as if you were pointing out some flaw in my reasoning? An 'equally ignorant' Destruction warlock would not have the mind to point out that they never bothered with the other two choices, so why would you over-analyze what I just spelled-out?
Hunters dont have spells, and how many hunters can easily re-summon any "pet" they like to match a situation? Do hunters not have only one pet at a time, until they choose to re-train a new one to match their skill level? This is not a very good analogy, because hunters and warlocks are not alike in this way.
This is a quote from the WoW website: "Warlocks are masters of shadow, flame, and demonic power." "Hunters also possess a primal connection to the beasts of Azeroth, capable of taming and training them to keep as loyal guardians." "Mages wield the elements of fire, frost, and the arcane to destroy or neutralize their enemies."
From those descriptions, Warlocks and Mages are more alike than Warlocks and Hunters.
Anyhow, I responded to help someone based on how I chose to play the game, and I clearly stated I was speaking in reference to those choices. So, I dont see where you get off saying that your choices are more valid.
Some equally ignorant destro lock could tell you he wouldnt go demo because he would be a hunter.
Shadowburn a waste? Hm..."
Uh what?
I said that I could not comment on Destruction, so what was the point of repeating what I said, as if you were pointing out some flaw in my reasoning? An 'equally ignorant' Destruction warlock would not have the mind to point out that they never bothered with the other two choices, so why would you over-analyze what I just spelled-out?
Hunters dont have spells, and how many hunters can easily re-summon any "pet" they like to match a situation? Do hunters not have only one pet at a time, until they choose to re-train a new one to match their skill level? This is not a very good analogy, because hunters and warlocks are not alike in this way.
This is a quote from the WoW website: "Warlocks are masters of shadow, flame, and demonic power." "Hunters also possess a primal connection to the beasts of Azeroth, capable of taming and training them to keep as loyal guardians." "Mages wield the elements of fire, frost, and the arcane to destroy or neutralize their enemies."
From those descriptions, Warlocks and Mages are more alike than Warlocks and Hunters.
Anyhow, I responded to help someone based on how I chose to play the game, and I clearly stated I was speaking in reference to those choices. So, I dont see where you get off saying that your choices are more valid.
You're dumbbb. Sethy's right, ^ dumb...
Now that is not nice, no need for insults.
@ Sederix
I was simply pointing out that if you never played destro you are not competent to give advices and compare something with it.
Seeing that you find putting any point in destro a waste and claiming that Imp HS is specially important talent in demo tree - I cannot draw any other conclusion but that you are ignorant about both.
My mark about hunter compared to demo lock is same as comparing mage to destro lock. Mages and warlocks may seem alike to you, but they are 2 very different classes just as hunter and warlock.
If the main base where you gather your knowledge is WoW begginers info on official site, I would suggest you restrain a bit from giving advices before you actually play some class up to certain level.
@ Sederix
I was simply pointing out that if you never played destro you are not competent to give advices and compare something with it.
Seeing that you find putting any point in destro a waste and claiming that Imp HS is specially important talent in demo tree - I cannot draw any other conclusion but that you are ignorant about both.
My mark about hunter compared to demo lock is same as comparing mage to destro lock. Mages and warlocks may seem alike to you, but they are 2 very different classes just as hunter and warlock.
If the main base where you gather your knowledge is WoW begginers info on official site, I would suggest you restrain a bit from giving advices before you actually play some class up to certain level.
Affliction and drain tanking is generally considered the most effective way for soloing.
It has very little down time beceause you esentially neven go out of HP and mana due to your drains being hella buffed and dark pact+imp= practically unlimited mana.
From the O-boards, heres a breakdown of how to do it:
INTRODUCTION
Stop asking what the best spec for leveling is. AFFLICTION is the best grinding spec up to 60. Affliction is taken at these levels because it has the strongest early and later talents for providing solo DPS.
Demonology suffers because it obtains very little solo DPS talents until level the later levels, but even then it lacks versatility until Felguard gets all of his skills and you have more space for talents (ie around 60). Destruction suffers from poor management of mana and health.
Keep this in mind: Demonology and Destruction are VIABLE leveling talent builds, BUT they are LESS EFFICIENT than Affliction if you plan on soloing. Boredom causes you to check your myspace instead of leveling up your Warlock. If Affliction causes you to be bored to tears, you can try out Demonology or Destruction for grinding.
SPEC
A build like THIS is your immediate goal:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=AVMrVRfkqtbo
Here is the order which you will place points if you want to level EFFICIENTLY.
5/5 Imp Corruption
2/2 Improved Drain Soul
2/2 Soul Siphon
1/2 Improved Life Tap
5/5 Fel Concentration
2/2 Grim Reach
2/2 Nightfall
2/2 Improved Life Tap
1/1 Siphon Life
1/1 Amplify Curse
3/3 Empowered Corruption
5/5 Shadow Mastery
1/1 Dark Pact
5/5 Contagion
2/2 Improved Howl of Terror
1/5 Shadow Embrace (ONLY ONE POINT! YOU ONLY WANT IT FOR THE ADDITIONAL DEBUFF TO HELP SOUL SIPHON AND ANTI-DISPELS)
1/1 Curse of Exhaustion
1/1 Unstable Affliction
After that point, it doesn't really matter where you put them. I recommend going for Bane asap to maximize instance DPS. You can also choose to get Demonic Embrace if you're paranoid, but it's better to increase DPS. Suppression is also a good idea, and Improved Curse of Agony if you refuse to move outside of Affliction.
Get lots of +shadow gear, but don't completely neglect your stamina stat. SPIRIT is WORTHLESS. Intellect is NOT VERY GOOD. Just mass +dmg and +sta.
PROCESS
For most of your Warlock's career after ~30 or 40, your Warlock will be leveling through a method called DRAIN TANKING.
HERE IS HOW YOU DRAIN TANK:
Use Succubus with all auto-casts off or Imp with Fire Bolt turned off. Imp if you have +dmg; Succubus if you have practically none, OR if you're on a PvP server grinding in a terrible place like STV.
-Locate mob
-Start Immolate/UA/Shadow Bolt, generally you'll only have time for one
-Apply instant DoT's
-Drain Tank until mob is dead, using Nightfall Shadow Bolt procs as they occur
-Mash Dark Pact as you confront your next mob
This is for single mob grinding. For multiple mobs, you will be applying your instant DoT's to all of them, and you will kite them by running. MAKE SURE YOU KEEP APPLYING DOTS ONCE IN A WHILE, OR THEY WILL DEAGRO. When they get close, Howl of Terror if you're in a safe area.
AFTER 60
After around level 60, the gap in leveling speed between the three specs shrinks considerably.
Felguard specs become very powerful around level 60. Th
It has very little down time beceause you esentially neven go out of HP and mana due to your drains being hella buffed and dark pact+imp= practically unlimited mana.
From the O-boards, heres a breakdown of how to do it:
INTRODUCTION
Stop asking what the best spec for leveling is. AFFLICTION is the best grinding spec up to 60. Affliction is taken at these levels because it has the strongest early and later talents for providing solo DPS.
Demonology suffers because it obtains very little solo DPS talents until level the later levels, but even then it lacks versatility until Felguard gets all of his skills and you have more space for talents (ie around 60). Destruction suffers from poor management of mana and health.
Keep this in mind: Demonology and Destruction are VIABLE leveling talent builds, BUT they are LESS EFFICIENT than Affliction if you plan on soloing. Boredom causes you to check your myspace instead of leveling up your Warlock. If Affliction causes you to be bored to tears, you can try out Demonology or Destruction for grinding.
SPEC
A build like THIS is your immediate goal:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=AVMrVRfkqtbo
Here is the order which you will place points if you want to level EFFICIENTLY.
5/5 Imp Corruption
2/2 Improved Drain Soul
2/2 Soul Siphon
1/2 Improved Life Tap
5/5 Fel Concentration
2/2 Grim Reach
2/2 Nightfall
2/2 Improved Life Tap
1/1 Siphon Life
1/1 Amplify Curse
3/3 Empowered Corruption
5/5 Shadow Mastery
1/1 Dark Pact
5/5 Contagion
2/2 Improved Howl of Terror
1/5 Shadow Embrace (ONLY ONE POINT! YOU ONLY WANT IT FOR THE ADDITIONAL DEBUFF TO HELP SOUL SIPHON AND ANTI-DISPELS)
1/1 Curse of Exhaustion
1/1 Unstable Affliction
After that point, it doesn't really matter where you put them. I recommend going for Bane asap to maximize instance DPS. You can also choose to get Demonic Embrace if you're paranoid, but it's better to increase DPS. Suppression is also a good idea, and Improved Curse of Agony if you refuse to move outside of Affliction.
Get lots of +shadow gear, but don't completely neglect your stamina stat. SPIRIT is WORTHLESS. Intellect is NOT VERY GOOD. Just mass +dmg and +sta.
PROCESS
For most of your Warlock's career after ~30 or 40, your Warlock will be leveling through a method called DRAIN TANKING.
HERE IS HOW YOU DRAIN TANK:
Use Succubus with all auto-casts off or Imp with Fire Bolt turned off. Imp if you have +dmg; Succubus if you have practically none, OR if you're on a PvP server grinding in a terrible place like STV.
-Locate mob
-Start Immolate/UA/Shadow Bolt, generally you'll only have time for one
-Apply instant DoT's
-Drain Tank until mob is dead, using Nightfall Shadow Bolt procs as they occur
-Mash Dark Pact as you confront your next mob
This is for single mob grinding. For multiple mobs, you will be applying your instant DoT's to all of them, and you will kite them by running. MAKE SURE YOU KEEP APPLYING DOTS ONCE IN A WHILE, OR THEY WILL DEAGRO. When they get close, Howl of Terror if you're in a safe area.
AFTER 60
After around level 60, the gap in leveling speed between the three specs shrinks considerably.
Felguard specs become very powerful around level 60. Th
Both Affliction and Demonology are excellent levelling trees. Either one you pick you'll want the other as support, usually with a little aplsh of Destro thron in at the end for good measure. Destro can also be a decent levelling build, though you'll probably be OOM frequently, never tried it, but that's what I;ve heard others say.
While Affl and Demo can probably solo up to 70 equally well, they will both play very very differently. If you go mostly Demo, you will play similar to a Hunter, hiding behind your pet with him doing most of the work, if he falls, you more than likely will also, except once you get down the tree a little ways, you can pop a new one out in under a second.
Affliction still uses the pet, however, it's more for damage, or a mana battery later. Your DoTs and Drains are more powerful, and you stand a better chance of surviving if your pet goes away.
Either way, you still DoT and Drain mostly, maybe Drain a little less with a Demo lock.
What is your draw to the Demo tree? Is it the Felguard? If so, don't even think about him until 56, as before that, he is a little gimp as you do not have the necesary talents to support him, and will not have you instant cast Corr if you do. He also doesn't get some of his abilities until 56 that make him the powerhouse he is. You can still go Demo until then, just focus more on Big Blue.
As for builds, I post them around here all the time and do not have the time at work today to plan out builds, look thru the other build advice threads and you'll find much of the same info.
While Affl and Demo can probably solo up to 70 equally well, they will both play very very differently. If you go mostly Demo, you will play similar to a Hunter, hiding behind your pet with him doing most of the work, if he falls, you more than likely will also, except once you get down the tree a little ways, you can pop a new one out in under a second.
Affliction still uses the pet, however, it's more for damage, or a mana battery later. Your DoTs and Drains are more powerful, and you stand a better chance of surviving if your pet goes away.
Either way, you still DoT and Drain mostly, maybe Drain a little less with a Demo lock.
What is your draw to the Demo tree? Is it the Felguard? If so, don't even think about him until 56, as before that, he is a little gimp as you do not have the necesary talents to support him, and will not have you instant cast Corr if you do. He also doesn't get some of his abilities until 56 that make him the powerhouse he is. You can still go Demo until then, just focus more on Big Blue.
As for builds, I post them around here all the time and do not have the time at work today to plan out builds, look thru the other build advice threads and you'll find much of the same info.
The only problem I have with demo is that its rather slow for leveling and it dosent work as you think it should.
You figure that you will throw out the blueberry and play hunter for a while right?
Well, it dosent end up being that way.
When I was demo spec before felguard, I mostly threw my pet out on a mob, DOTed him, feared him and began with the next mob while my pet finished off the other mob (became easier with Soul link).
But the problem was, even if I drained a mob, my hp and mana couldnt keep up with my grind speed making me drink.
After felguard, you can play hunter or you can continue the DOT+fear path, only a bit faster and he makes the whole ordeal easier.
So its up to you really, but affliction will be a bit faster and has lower risks involved. Its all up to your play style, really.
But dont even consider destro while grinding. Its powerful, but horribly mana inneficent. You essentially play mage without the summoned water, and drain mana isnt efficent enough to keep you afloat.
You figure that you will throw out the blueberry and play hunter for a while right?
Well, it dosent end up being that way.
When I was demo spec before felguard, I mostly threw my pet out on a mob, DOTed him, feared him and began with the next mob while my pet finished off the other mob (became easier with Soul link).
But the problem was, even if I drained a mob, my hp and mana couldnt keep up with my grind speed making me drink.
After felguard, you can play hunter or you can continue the DOT+fear path, only a bit faster and he makes the whole ordeal easier.
So its up to you really, but affliction will be a bit faster and has lower risks involved. Its all up to your play style, really.
But dont even consider destro while grinding. Its powerful, but horribly mana inneficent. You essentially play mage without the summoned water, and drain mana isnt efficent enough to keep you afloat.
This is untrue. You are suggesting that I have to play a Destruction warlock or a Fire mage in order to understand what each does-- that's just illogical, because information on these classes is very public, and should be common knowledge to someone who is claiming not to be ignorant on the subject. Then of course, it is likely that one would come across at least one of these types of classes while playing the game, so your assertion has a hole in it.
And, I will explain why your analogy and your assessment is incorrect, using information directly from the WoW website, so you can see that I am not making up anything, or being "ignorant". I will objectively compare Warlocks, Mages and Hunters, using the examples you and I presented: if Fire Mage::Destruction, then Hunter::Demonology. I say Fire mage, because Destruction is fire-based, so a more accurate comparison can be made.
Fire Mage: (1) Casts spells. (2) Uses fire-based spells as a primary source of damage. (3) Limited to cloth armor. (4) Dependent on mana for use of most abilities.
Des. Warlock: (1) Casts spells. (2) Uses fire-based spells as a primary source of damage. (3) Limited to cloth armor. (4) Dependent on mana for use of most abilities.
Similarity ratio is 4:4, or 100% out of 100%.
Dem. Warock: (1) Uses demons as a source of attack and defense. (2) Casts spells. (3) Trains pets instantly with grimoires. (4) Can dismiss and summon a new pet at any almost time. (5) Can Enslave demons for 5mins. (6) Demons level with the caster. (7) Can heal self or party members with Healthstones. (8) Can resurrect self or party members with Soulstones. (9) Demons (except the imp) can use physical and magickal attacks. (10) Demons do not eat.
Hunter: (1) Uses beasts as source of damage and defence. (2) Does not cast spells. (3) Pet abilities are acquired only after time has been spent with it. (4) Must re-capture and re-train new pets. (5) Pets remain with the hunter indefinatly or until a new pet is captured; types of beasts is limited. (6) Pets level independently, and can only gain experience based on level differences between hunter and between their target. (7) Can not heal self or party members with any ability. (8) Can not heal or resurrect party members with any ability. (9) Pets are limited to physical damage only. (10) Pets must be fed.
Similarity ratio is 1:11, or 9% out of 100%.
Now, please, if you have any points to add or amend, I would like to see it. If you disagree with any of the points made, then explain.
You are making a lot of personal attacks and claims at being correct, so I would like you to explain how you think your analogy can have more merit. Compare and contrast each paradigm in an objective manner, as I have done.
Edited, Aug 13th 2007 11:26pm by sederix
Edited, Aug 13th 2007 11:27pm by sederix
And, I will explain why your analogy and your assessment is incorrect, using information directly from the WoW website, so you can see that I am not making up anything, or being "ignorant". I will objectively compare Warlocks, Mages and Hunters, using the examples you and I presented: if Fire Mage::Destruction, then Hunter::Demonology. I say Fire mage, because Destruction is fire-based, so a more accurate comparison can be made.
Fire Mage: (1) Casts spells. (2) Uses fire-based spells as a primary source of damage. (3) Limited to cloth armor. (4) Dependent on mana for use of most abilities.
Des. Warlock: (1) Casts spells. (2) Uses fire-based spells as a primary source of damage. (3) Limited to cloth armor. (4) Dependent on mana for use of most abilities.
Similarity ratio is 4:4, or 100% out of 100%.
Dem. Warock: (1) Uses demons as a source of attack and defense. (2) Casts spells. (3) Trains pets instantly with grimoires. (4) Can dismiss and summon a new pet at any almost time. (5) Can Enslave demons for 5mins. (6) Demons level with the caster. (7) Can heal self or party members with Healthstones. (8) Can resurrect self or party members with Soulstones. (9) Demons (except the imp) can use physical and magickal attacks. (10) Demons do not eat.
Hunter: (1) Uses beasts as source of damage and defence. (2) Does not cast spells. (3) Pet abilities are acquired only after time has been spent with it. (4) Must re-capture and re-train new pets. (5) Pets remain with the hunter indefinatly or until a new pet is captured; types of beasts is limited. (6) Pets level independently, and can only gain experience based on level differences between hunter and between their target. (7) Can not heal self or party members with any ability. (8) Can not heal or resurrect party members with any ability. (9) Pets are limited to physical damage only. (10) Pets must be fed.
Similarity ratio is 1:11, or 9% out of 100%.
Now, please, if you have any points to add or amend, I would like to see it. If you disagree with any of the points made, then explain.
You are making a lot of personal attacks and claims at being correct, so I would like you to explain how you think your analogy can have more merit. Compare and contrast each paradigm in an objective manner, as I have done.
Edited, Aug 13th 2007 11:26pm by sederix
Edited, Aug 13th 2007 11:27pm by sederix
sederix wrote:
Dem. Warock: (1) Uses demons as a source of attack and defense. (2) Casts spells. (3) Trains pets instantly with grimoires. (4) Can dismiss and summon a new pet at any almost time. (5) Can Enslave demons for 5mins. (6) Demons level with the caster. (7) Can heal self or party members with Healthstones. (8) Can resurrect self or party members with Soulstones. (9) Demons (except the imp) can use physical and magickal attacks. (10) Demons do not eat.
Hunter: (1) Uses beasts as source of damage and defence. (2) Does not cast spells. (3) Pet abilities are acquired only after time has been spent with it. (4) Must re-capture and re-train new pets. (5) Pets remain with the hunter indefinatly or until a new pet is captured; types of beasts is limited. (6) Pets level independently, and can only gain experience based on level differences between hunter and between their target. (7) Can not heal self or party members with any ability. (8) Can not heal or resurrect party members with any ability. (9) Pets are limited to physical damage only. (10) Pets must be fed.
Similarity ratio is 1:11, or 9% out of 100%.
Now, please, if you have any points to add or amend, I would like to see it. If you disagree with any of the points made, then explain.
You are making a lot of personal attacks and claims at being correct, so I would like you to explain how you think your analogy can have more merit. Compare and contrast each paradigm in an objective manner, as I have done.
Hahahah.. God, you're so ignorant and manipulative. Lets see here, last time I checked everything that in bold up there are things that seperate Warlocks from Mages too. You can't just make a generic, basic list of things Warlocks and Mages can both do and say "Hey, they're the same thing!", then make a list of everything different about a Warlock and a Hunter.
Learn to argue.
stainlessteel wrote:
PROCESS
For most of your Warlock's career after ~30 or 40, your Warlock will be leveling through a method called DRAIN TANKING.
HERE IS HOW YOU DRAIN TANK:
Use Succubus with all auto-casts off or Imp with Fire Bolt turned off. Imp if you have +dmg; Succubus if you have practically none, OR if you're on a PvP server grinding in a terrible place like STV.
-Locate mob
-Start Immolate/UA/Shadow Bolt, generally you'll only have time for one
-Apply instant DoT's
-Drain Tank until mob is dead, using Nightfall Shadow Bolt procs as they occur
-Mash Dark Pact as you confront your next mob
This is for single mob grinding. For multiple mobs, you will be applying your instant DoT's to all of them, and you will kite them by running. MAKE SURE YOU KEEP APPLYING DOTS ONCE IN A WHILE, OR THEY WILL DEAGRO. When they get close, Howl of Terror if you're in a safe area.
For most of your Warlock's career after ~30 or 40, your Warlock will be leveling through a method called DRAIN TANKING.
HERE IS HOW YOU DRAIN TANK:
Use Succubus with all auto-casts off or Imp with Fire Bolt turned off. Imp if you have +dmg; Succubus if you have practically none, OR if you're on a PvP server grinding in a terrible place like STV.
-Locate mob
-Start Immolate/UA/Shadow Bolt, generally you'll only have time for one
-Apply instant DoT's
-Drain Tank until mob is dead, using Nightfall Shadow Bolt procs as they occur
-Mash Dark Pact as you confront your next mob
This is for single mob grinding. For multiple mobs, you will be applying your instant DoT's to all of them, and you will kite them by running. MAKE SURE YOU KEEP APPLYING DOTS ONCE IN A WHILE, OR THEY WILL DEAGRO. When they get close, Howl of Terror if you're in a safe area.
I prefer DRAIN HUNTING.
HERE IS HOW YOU DRAIN HUNT:
Single mob:
Send in your VW - wait for him to arrive and gain aggro: Siphon Life, Curse of Agony, Corruption, (wait for another taunt, if you apply Immolate), Life Tap, Drain Life - the mob should be dead or near dead. It will normally die from the residual DoTs, but you can finish it off if you want. If you finish with a Drain Soul and are specced for Improved Drain Soul, you will be at full HP and mana when you finish.
Multiple mobs: Send in VW agains a group. Cast Siphon Life on as many of the mobs as you can, then concentrate on the final one as above. As soon as one has the full spell list, go to the next one. Make sure that your VW casts the group taunt as often as possible, so he maintains aggro. No need to kite, and your VW should be good against 4 same-level mobs. If you go against more than 4, then you might have to heal him a bit - bandages are best for this. After a multi-mob fight, don't forget to have your VW consume shadows to get his health back.
Edited, Aug 14th 2007 12:07am by ohmikeghod
"Lets see here, last time I checked everything that in bold up there are things that seperate Warlocks from Mages too..."
So, what you are saying is that mages have pets that need to be trained? Mages can train beasts? Could you perhaps be more specific with your replies, than just saying I am wrong because you say so? I did say if any amendments were to be made, then suggest them-- you had the opportunity in that last post, but you instead gave me a rather condescending answer that did not explain anything.
The "learn to argue" is clever. Notice how you have not yet supported your reasoning in any way, other than by saying I am wrong. If you are going to refute me, then back it up with reasoning and facts. Ever point I made can be found on the official website, and any other place that discusses these classes.
So, what you are saying is that mages have pets that need to be trained? Mages can train beasts? Could you perhaps be more specific with your replies, than just saying I am wrong because you say so? I did say if any amendments were to be made, then suggest them-- you had the opportunity in that last post, but you instead gave me a rather condescending answer that did not explain anything.
The "learn to argue" is clever. Notice how you have not yet supported your reasoning in any way, other than by saying I am wrong. If you are going to refute me, then back it up with reasoning and facts. Ever point I made can be found on the official website, and any other place that discusses these classes.
sederix wrote:
"Lets see here, last time I checked everything that in bold up there are things that seperate Warlocks from Mages too..."
So, what you are saying is that mages have pets that need to be trained? Mages can train beasts? Could you perhaps be more specific with your replies, than just saying I am wrong because you say so? I did say if any amendments were to be made, then suggest them-- you had the opportunity in that last post, but you instead gave me a rather condescending answer that did not explain anything.
The "learn to argue" is clever. Notice how you have not yet supported your reasoning in any way, other than by saying I am wrong. If you are going to refute me, then back it up with reasoning and facts. Ever point I made can be found on the official website, and any other place that discusses these classes.
So, what you are saying is that mages have pets that need to be trained? Mages can train beasts? Could you perhaps be more specific with your replies, than just saying I am wrong because you say so? I did say if any amendments were to be made, then suggest them-- you had the opportunity in that last post, but you instead gave me a rather condescending answer that did not explain anything.
The "learn to argue" is clever. Notice how you have not yet supported your reasoning in any way, other than by saying I am wrong. If you are going to refute me, then back it up with reasoning and facts. Ever point I made can be found on the official website, and any other place that discusses these classes.
No, dimwit. What he was saying is that even Destro-locks have pets and use them, which is something you "conveniently" overlooked when making your comparison.
sederix wrote:
You are suggesting that I have to play a Destruction warlock or a Fire mage in order to understand what each does
Exactly.
Or play with some of them.
Or just play WoW instead of reading about it on official website.
sederix wrote:
"Lets see here, last time I checked everything that in bold up there are things that seperate Warlocks from Mages too..."
So, what you are saying is that mages have pets that need to be trained? Mages can train beasts? Could you perhaps be more specific with your replies, than just saying I am wrong because you say so?
So, what you are saying is that mages have pets that need to be trained? Mages can train beasts? Could you perhaps be more specific with your replies, than just saying I am wrong because you say so?
First, allow me to apologize. I didn't know you were that dense that you needed everything spelled out for you. But as it would seem from your latest reply (accidentally posted as a new thread *whoops*)... Here, let me throw it in this thread for you:
sederix wrote:
"No, dimwit. What he was saying is that even Destro-locks have pets and use them, which is something you "conveniently" overlooked when making your comparison."
Actually, I was comparing Destruction Warlocks to Fire Mages, and then I compared Hunters to Demonology Warlocks. The original comment, was that if Fire Mages are like Destruction Warlocks, then conversely, Hunters must be like Demonology Warlocks, so I had to compare those two paradigms. Adding that point to the former would not make a significant difference, so the other points still need to be refuted.
Instead of bickering, why do any of you not respond with facts and reasoning to support your view? I have not seen that-- and no, calling me wrong or ignorant is not a counter-argument.
Actually, I was comparing Destruction Warlocks to Fire Mages, and then I compared Hunters to Demonology Warlocks. The original comment, was that if Fire Mages are like Destruction Warlocks, then conversely, Hunters must be like Demonology Warlocks, so I had to compare those two paradigms. Adding that point to the former would not make a significant difference, so the other points still need to be refuted.
Instead of bickering, why do any of you not respond with facts and reasoning to support your view? I have not seen that-- and no, calling me wrong or ignorant is not a counter-argument.
First of all, bravo on the capacious amount of large words. Too bad thesaurus.com can't also raise your IQ. Now, onto the spelling out:
In your little comparison post, you first "flawlessly prove" that Dest. Warlocks and Fire Mages are the same thing by posting 4 of the most very basic things that both those classes do. Then you go on to compare how different Demo Warlocks are to Hunters by trying to think of every thing that differentiates those two classes. What you don't seem to realize is that all of the non-redundant points about Demo Warlocks are also things that make Dest. Warlocks different than Fire Mages.
As I previously reposted, in bold, Fire Mages cannot:
(1) Use demons as a source of attack and defense
(3) Train pets instantly with grimoires.
(4) Dismiss and summon a new pet at almost any time.
(5) Enslave demons for 5mins.
(6) Have demons level with the caster.
(7) Heal self or party members with Healthstones.
(8) Resurrect self or party members with Soulstones.
Not to mention that Fire Mages also can't:
- DoT
- Fear
- Death Coil
- Spell Stone
- Life Tap
- Drain Life and Mana
- Drain Soul to replenish 15% of total mana every fight
Is that clear enough for you? Or should I expect another solid square a gibberish with liberal use of big people vocabulary?
Oh and mike... I actally loled at your reply and wasn't even going to bother replying again until i saw his new thread entitled "re:"
Hirunobi wrote:
Oh and mike... I actally loled at your reply and wasn't even going to bother replying again until i saw his new thread entitled "re:"
You can see my response in his "re:" thread.
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