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I have a dilemmaFollow

#1 Aug 11 2007 at 4:51 PM Rating: Decent
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I am not raiding lock, I mostly farm and do quests and ocasional 5 men when I gather nice group of friends. It actually became too easy so we plan to try heroics for a change.

Now I gathered some new stuff and am trying it. I got about 500 more hp and quite nice amount of hit and penetration but I lost bit of spell damage (not much really) and mostly crit.

I am wondering now is it worth it. I am going to play like this for a while and see how it goes but I would like to hear your opinions too please :)



Edited, Aug 11th 2007 8:55pm by Sethy
#2 Aug 11 2007 at 5:30 PM Rating: Decent

I don't really understand what responses you seek in this post, but oh well.
After seeing what I believe to be your armory (Redemptio right ?) I can tell you this.

Your gear is pretty similar to mine before I started Karazhan, actually even a bit better, you should be pretty neatly befitting your dps role, I'd actually be more worried about your tank and healer in any case.

Do take into account your felguard will be of little use in most heroics, he will be easily two/three-shotted when you least expect it. You will have to start placing a bit more of faith on your succubus for seducing those nasty adds. You will also want to use the imp more, since it wont die unless you SL him and get quite damaged, and it will reduce your aggro, which is really nice in instances were there are mobs that can 1-shot you.

For starters go to Mechanar or maybe one of the Hellfire lower instances to get a hang of it if most of you aren't accustomed to heroics. Always pull the minimal number of mobs possible, and try hard to keep CC on all except the tanks target (assuming he is warrior or feral). Take a mage with you, and a nice rogue/hunter if possible, if both stack similar dps as you do you shouldnt have many to any problemas with dps.

And is it worth it ? why yes, it is, Primal Nethers allow Leatherworkers, Tailors and Blacksmiths to pull up some neat gear, and Badges of Justice can be exchanged for some really nice items as well. Besides you can easily get epic gems, and may get some epic drops which in general are mostly Kara-level.

So, I hope that helps somewhat, oh and good luck.


PS. you dont really need the penetration for much of anything in pve you know that don't you ?
#3 Aug 11 2007 at 6:04 PM Rating: Decent
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I was wondering if +hit is more worth to me than +crit.

My friend is trying to persuade me into PvP for some time now so I guess that penetration and resilience wont be actually lost. But shouldnt more penetration mean less resist in PvE too?

My actual dilemma is between mana-etched crown versus second sight helm, and continuum blade + star heart lamp versus the bringer of death. That is where I lost around 4% crit and gained around 2% hit. I was also wondering if that 5% of half casting time on next spell meta gem is worth having or I should go for +12 spell damage one or maybe +crit one.

Oh I am very aware I cant use my pet as offtank in heroics. I can use succubus if I have to, its not a big deal, I just hate to loose felguard because he adds nice amount of dps. And I do hate succubus :D

I have mage and rogue, they are my guildies and very good friends from before WoW and not worse geared than me, we are around same on damage meters. So guess we could go explore heroics if we find some decent tank and healer.

I am in no rush to get all epics but I like to have balanced gear all the time even if its greenies rather than wait for something I might get some day.


Edited, Aug 11th 2007 10:04pm by Sethy
#4 Aug 11 2007 at 9:21 PM Rating: Decent
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For heroics, I'd go with spell damage mainly. Hits not super important in non raids, and penetration is basically a PVP stat. Mobs are different in heroics, they hit incredibly hard on cloth. You'll generally get 1 shotted if you pull aggro, so 500 extra health will almost never help you. Spell damage (high as you can get), stam, hit + int, spell crit somewhere in the middle for destro builds.


edit - if you're friends trying to talk you into PVP, I'd work on 2 sets. A stam set where stam (and resilience) are top priority. If you're felguard build spell crit is really huge, you'd want stam + resilience + spell damage + some penetration (dont need much) + spell crit (in that order).

For PVE (like heroics) you really just need spell damage and maybe 80-100 hit. I could be wrong there, but I never seemed to get resisted with that amount.

Edited, Aug 12th 2007 1:24am by mikelolol
#5 Aug 11 2007 at 11:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Yes, I figured I would need 2 sets if I go PvP. I am not very comfortable about it, I never did and dont think I would like but but oh well I promised to try and cant have headache excuses all the time.

Spell damage (shadow) I can get to some 1200 buffed with my usual gadgets at this moment and hit I have 77 with Scryers trinket plus I have 2 points in Supression.
What I dont like is that I lost lot of crit with new weapon combination, from almost 19% buffed to hardly 15%. But then I am full demo apart from 11 points in destro for shadowburn.

I know I dont need much sta for heroics but I do farm a lot too and run normal instances and then I would feel the difference in some 1-2k hp more or less.
Guess its time to finish Battlecast and start working on Spellstrike.

Oh and one more question. What do you guys think about new Darkmoon cards? I got lucky with few lunacies and blessings and am wondering now would it be useful to keep them and complete those decks for myself or just sell?

#6 Aug 12 2007 at 1:57 AM Rating: Decent

In general extra +hit is supposed to enchance your dps further than +crit, but then mobs in heroics are just level 70 and 50-60 hit should be enough to have very little problems against them. So if you have that covered I'd go for more spell damage, and maybe afterwards more crit.

And penetration doesn't usually do much in instances, as it lowers the enemies resistances and I believe most mobs don't have any resistances so to speak.

I would personally keep continuum blade and Star heart lamp, if you are going to suffer for your crit rating then by all means do Hellfire heroics until you reach exalted and can buy yourself the Stormcaller.
I would also rather wear the Cowl of Oblivion than any of those two heads (specially rather than Helmet of second sight).
And I love Mystical Skyfire Diamond, but then if you want maximum efficiency then maybe you could grab a Swift Starfire in its stead, but I manage pretty neatly with my mystical (and healing myself of over 2000 damage through draining in 2.5 seconds is something I find to be priceless :)

As for Darkmoon cards, Storms can be nice for a warlock trying to keep imp shadowbolt debuff up but then that is only really important in raids, else you can use a more useful trinket. And blessings is actually somewhat nice if you can keep the buff up through constant casting, but I have my doubts about it being worth the investment. Madness I don't like at all, I could care less for a post-killing random buff, even thought it is ok for pvp (mainly for its 500hp).

If I were you I'd take ancient draenei talisman/Vengeance of the Illidari/Scryers trinket gem. And when you get enough Justice Badges first spend them on the beautiful Icon of the Silver Crescent.
#7 Aug 12 2007 at 4:20 AM Rating: Decent
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You have been very helpful, thanks :)

I was counting +hit in % because of those 2 points in Supression, at this moment I have bit over 7% without Scryers trinket.

I will enchant Subtlety on the cloak then instead of penetration. I did encounter a "resist" messages sometimes but not lately.

Yes I am actually planning to go for HH rep sword (not Stormcaller tho, I am Alliance). As for the head its just matter of days when will I get Battlecast/Spellstrike hood so I guess its been hair splitting on my side.

I am trying that Mystical Skyfire right now on plain farming and so far it seems to proc pretty nicely. But I rather like steady safe things and I get annoyed when I get procs in wrong time. We are going to run SL tonight maybe few times for spellstrike pattern so I guess I will change to the other one (ran out of shards :D). Not that it matter much but oh well I might find some other piece with meta gem slot and then I will know what I want.

Vengeance of the Illidari is what I have all the time, plus that Zangar quest bit of damage one which I swap with Scryers +hit trinket..... I am for sure aiming for the Icon of the Silver Crescent (along with some other stuff).
Thanks for the insight on cards, I guess I will just keep them around on bank alt, see if I can get full deck and check the prices. I am not in cash need so they can wait.
I might consider keeping the +51 sta one if by some weird chance I decide I like PvP.

Well, you helped me a lot to make up my mind.... I really hate to be undecided about things :)


Edited, Aug 12th 2007 8:22am by Sethy
#8 Aug 12 2007 at 3:26 PM Rating: Decent

Sethy wrote:
(not Stormcaller tho, I am Alliance)

Wasn't really taking the fact into account when I said that heh, but I do guess you must have an equivalent.

Spellstrike is real nice for PvE action, I gave up on getting the patterns some time ago thought, and kept running with Oblivion and Battlecast pants (which aint that bad for a demonologist warlock now are they ? and useful for pvp too).

And on a last note, I have been told, and have read around the forums, that heroic Blood Furnace is not as easy (couldn't know personally as I have never found a party to run, which just makes sense with it being kinda hard). So give Mechanar, Ramparts or Slave Pens a run for starters and youll be doing ok I hope.

Well, for one I think it is good you try out more aspects of the game instead of just farming, so again, good luck with that (arenas too).
#9 Aug 12 2007 at 10:52 PM Rating: Decent
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1,571 posts
Blade of the Archmage - same thing really.

Spellstrike pattern eh.
My mage friend is a tailor too and since he is much more assertive person and can stand PuGs better than me he got few nethers already.
My battlecast pants and girdle of ruination are actually a present from him, I lost interest in playing my lock so he figured he might get me back that way - he was partially right.
And he is very set on having spellstrike with his signature (mine would do too I guess).

I was more after Murmur sword myself and once when my friend wasnt on (if he is I never do instances without him) BOTH pants pattern and sword dropped. So, knowing how much he wanted those pants I passed on the sword and rolled for the pattern - and lost the roll :(
6k rep short from exalted with Lower City all on SL runs - and I never saw either the pattern or sword again.

I cant run anything but CoT and Auchenai because I dont have the rep for other keys but I will get them all in few runs I guess, not that far.

Well, its not that I only farmed all the time, I used to run instances at lower levels and when I started Outlands and I did lot group quests and stuff like that.
But then for some reason I got depressed when I hit 70 and couldnt make myself do much more than farming and fishing. I am getting interest in game slowly back now and I hope it will be fun again as it used to be :)

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