Somebody told me that "nobody wants a rogue for 70 instances". What are your experiences? It seems to me that rogue dps, cc, and decent survivability (compared to clothies) are tremendous assets.
btw, the "somebody" is a guldmate, and my 39 rogue isn't my main, so I didn't take it as a slam or anything. I rolled a rogue because it's a fun class imo, and we rock in pvp.
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Rogues unwanted in end-game instances?Follow
He's wrong, although clothies attacking with range generally do have more survivability than rogues, who are in the mobs face being AoEd.
nothing can beat the dps of a well-played rogue in an instance. the rogues ive grouped with consistently outdo any other dps in terms of single target damage, only falling behind warlocks and mages in aoe situations. the only hurdle rogues have to overcome is their own idiocy; a good rogue who knows when to back off and when to pour on the damage is the epitome of what a dps class is.
While I agree with the responses, I will say that the impression out there is that rogues do require more maintenance than the caster classes.
IMHO, the class doesn't matter nearly as much as the skill of the player.
Also, ask yourself what you can do to enhance the viability of the party.
For example:
1) Listen to the party leader.
2) Sap at every opportunity.
3) Know your instances and volunteer to mark targets for cc/dps/off-tankage
4) Know when to backoff/feint/vanish/blind and stun. Throwing a kidneyshot in as a finisher (instead of an evis/s&D/Rupture when the party is in trouble can mean the difference between a wipe and finishing a fight.
Edited, Aug 6th 2007 10:39am by Slyyth
IMHO, the class doesn't matter nearly as much as the skill of the player.
Also, ask yourself what you can do to enhance the viability of the party.
For example:
1) Listen to the party leader.
2) Sap at every opportunity.
3) Know your instances and volunteer to mark targets for cc/dps/off-tankage
4) Know when to backoff/feint/vanish/blind and stun. Throwing a kidneyshot in as a finisher (instead of an evis/s&D/Rupture when the party is in trouble can mean the difference between a wipe and finishing a fight.
Edited, Aug 6th 2007 10:39am by Slyyth
I guess I should clarify my question. I'm not really asking if rogues are good to have along in high lvl instances, because imo they are. I'd like to know your opinion of how rogues are perceived by other classes. Do you have any trouble getting groups?
Depends on your server, its simple as that. Lots of Rogues = hard time getting a group unless you are very good.
There's really no way to cleanly generalize the perception of Rogues into an answer your looking for. It varies greatly from person to person, server to server, and guild to guild.
The one thing you can control is how people perceive your Rogue. I've known plenty of Rogues that have been downright terrible. I remember their names, and I avoid partying with them. I've got a friend, however, who plays one of the meanest Subtlety Rogues I've ever seen, usually out-DPS'ing equal-level Combat Rogues, and he's not even remotely close to twinked.
What matters isn't the class in general. It's your character, played by you.
The one thing you can control is how people perceive your Rogue. I've known plenty of Rogues that have been downright terrible. I remember their names, and I avoid partying with them. I've got a friend, however, who plays one of the meanest Subtlety Rogues I've ever seen, usually out-DPS'ing equal-level Combat Rogues, and he's not even remotely close to twinked.
What matters isn't the class in general. It's your character, played by you.
Basically means if you know how to play your class you will be requested for groups/raids, if you suck no one will want you. The same goes for every other class in WoW.
Scholar
45 posts
Yes it can be hard to find groups sometimes, especially if you're on a pvp server, where rogues are a dime a dozen (like hunters on pve). Rogues don't have aoe, can't reapply cc (though stuns are often overlooked as our form of cc in 5mans), no shareable buffs...However, that said, I have little trouble finding groups since the expansion...prior to BC though, I heard a lot of "sorry already got a rogue" or "LF any dps (no rogues)", but this is a popularity/population issue.
The sad thing is that in raiding there are only a few spots for melee dps because of chain spells and aoe and with the popularity of dps warriors and enhancement shamans growing, this makes the available rogue spots even fewer. However, as posted above, if you know how to avoid aoe and play your class well, you shouldn't have too many issues getting groups/raid spots. The rogue class is tons of fun to play and a solid addition to any group.
The sad thing is that in raiding there are only a few spots for melee dps because of chain spells and aoe and with the popularity of dps warriors and enhancement shamans growing, this makes the available rogue spots even fewer. However, as posted above, if you know how to avoid aoe and play your class well, you shouldn't have too many issues getting groups/raid spots. The rogue class is tons of fun to play and a solid addition to any group.
Pretty much what Gaudion said - there was a time there where rogues really were having trouble in instances when TBC first came out, but a patch or two ago they modified some of the instances to reduce some of the cleave/AoE attacks of the bosses so rogues are more balanced with regard to utility/maintenance.
As long as we stay on top of the DPS-charts, we'll be wanted...
And damn Blizz, put some more locked chests in those instances. :)
And damn Blizz, put some more locked chests in those instances. :)
Quote:
I rolled a rogue because it's a fun class imo, and we rock in pvp.
Actually, not so much at level 70.
Jophiel wrote:
I managed to be both retarded and entertaining.
every class rocks in pvp at 70 when done right. its just some classes take a bit more doing to do them right.
I've seen many rogues who just became "khorium lockbox" bots on 70 having no idea how to play and deal damage, good rogue almost as rare as good hunter.
Reason - way to 70 by solo and small grps doesn't require much knowledge and it's easy to make w/o learning anything.
Reason - way to 70 by solo and small grps doesn't require much knowledge and it's easy to make w/o learning anything.
21 posts
Yes, rogues are not that usefull. Problem is your firsts raid is probably going to be Kara, which is nearly all Undead, making a shadowpriest or hunter way more useful then a rogue, especially for Moroes.
ddddoooommmm wrote:
Yes, rogues are not that usefull. Problem is your firsts raid is probably going to be Kara, which is nearly all Undead, making a shadowpriest or hunter way more useful then a rogue, especially for Moroes.
I've never had anyone beat my DPS on bosses in Kara.
That includes SPriests and Locks that are equal to or better geared than me.
Hell, it even includes full T4 Hunters and Druids.
Shut the **** up until you know how to play the class.
Edited, Aug 9th 2007 2:49am by Theophany
He didn't say that rogue's dps was bad in kara, he said that other classes are more useful. Stfu yourself and read what ppl write instead of just blindly bashing everyone all the time.
I've had no issues being welcomed into a dungeon run. I have heard that some of the encounters and CC situations are geared more towards other classes but I've always pulled my own weight.
I did run into a situation a few nights ago when doing my first run through shadow labyrinths. Being the only other melee class other than the tank, I did die once when Murmur did his AoE thing.
Don't lose heart, we rogues have talents that other classes don't and as far as I have seen, we are still very much welcome into a group.
I did run into a situation a few nights ago when doing my first run through shadow labyrinths. Being the only other melee class other than the tank, I did die once when Murmur did his AoE thing.
Don't lose heart, we rogues have talents that other classes don't and as far as I have seen, we are still very much welcome into a group.
The Murmur fight from what I experienced is a server lag thing, on my main's server I do horrible on it, on my alt's I do great on it.
Glossu wrote:
He didn't say that rogue's dps was bad in kara, he said that other classes are more useful. Stfu yourself and read what ppl write instead of just blindly bashing everyone all the time.
The problem is that a good rogue can stunlock one of Moroes' adds down (usually the holy priest) and in my experience I kill her before the rest of the raid is done killing the first add.
And yes, I did read what he wrote. Hunters, in my experience, are 90% of the time morons when it comes to DPS. On my Hunter, I have no problems beating similarly geared people as BM, but for some reason that class attracts retards more than any other class.
When a Hunter is like, "wtf I've got 5/5 T4 and I've got all epics and I've got the highest DPS build, why am I last on DPS?" And you reply, "lol shot rotation" and they then say back, "lol wut?" you know you're in trouble.
My main is a hunter, and my alt is a rogue, Hunter is 62 and Rogue is 41, so i really don't have any end-game experience, but I do have lots of game experience with 7 other alts all at about lvl 30 (I get bored easily with some characters at about the lvl 25-30 mark),
Hunters and Rogues are the two most played classes that I know of, almost everyone has one or the other or both. That being said the percentage of retards playing the class is not going to differ any more than retards from any other class the difference is in the numbers, 50% of 10 is alot smaller than 50% of 1000.
Hunters are the quintessential "pet" class that people perceive as a solo class and Rogues are looked at as the main DPS class of the game, outside of mages of course but some people (myself included) don't like the idea of being beaten to a pulp in 2 seconds.
People play these classes as a simple "I WANNA DEAL DAMAGE" or "i wanna lvl up fast so I can get the good gear/ twink out my alts" or whetever the hell people like that think. Therefore, to be seen as a good player or welcome addition to the group you have to give yourself a name by playing your class, no matter what it is, well.
By this I mean, don't let people who see you playing a rogue go, oh he just wants to do damage, make them actually know that you're good at what you do and that damage is not the ONLY thing you're good at, survivng and CC are far more important than damage, you can't DO damage if you're dead.
As sad as it is, the only response I have to something like this,even after all that rambling is , L2P, and do it well, otherwise you're just another noob looking for a group
Hunters and Rogues are the two most played classes that I know of, almost everyone has one or the other or both. That being said the percentage of retards playing the class is not going to differ any more than retards from any other class the difference is in the numbers, 50% of 10 is alot smaller than 50% of 1000.
Hunters are the quintessential "pet" class that people perceive as a solo class and Rogues are looked at as the main DPS class of the game, outside of mages of course but some people (myself included) don't like the idea of being beaten to a pulp in 2 seconds.
People play these classes as a simple "I WANNA DEAL DAMAGE" or "i wanna lvl up fast so I can get the good gear/ twink out my alts" or whetever the hell people like that think. Therefore, to be seen as a good player or welcome addition to the group you have to give yourself a name by playing your class, no matter what it is, well.
By this I mean, don't let people who see you playing a rogue go, oh he just wants to do damage, make them actually know that you're good at what you do and that damage is not the ONLY thing you're good at, survivng and CC are far more important than damage, you can't DO damage if you're dead.
As sad as it is, the only response I have to something like this,even after all that rambling is , L2P, and do it well, otherwise you're just another noob looking for a group
The thing is, Katchii, that Hunter DPS is a lot harder than Rogue DPS. If you're even a fraction of a second off as a Hunter, you can drop your DPS by as much as 50.
Not so with a Rogue, where more than half of our DPS comes from just staring at the white numbers that pop up as we beat on the mob.
Not so with a Rogue, where more than half of our DPS comes from just staring at the white numbers that pop up as we beat on the mob.
Yep often I'm top in kara raids... excluding 2 class specific bosses:
a) On curator our shadowpriest have 100% time on boss to restore raid's mana while all DPS busy with flares and damage curator on evocations only.
b) Illhoof. on that fight good warlock is unbeatable, spamming seed to get rid of adds and it's huge overall damage.
a) On curator our shadowpriest have 100% time on boss to restore raid's mana while all DPS busy with flares and damage curator on evocations only.
b) Illhoof. on that fight good warlock is unbeatable, spamming seed to get rid of adds and it's huge overall damage.
Rogue DPS is about as easy as it gets, you maintain your finisher cycles and thats about it. We have no debuffs to worry about, we have don't have to worry about pushing debuffs off, and we have the best "oh **** I pulled aggro" skill in the game.
Quote:
and we have the best "oh sh*t I pulled aggro" skill in the game.
i personally would rather have feign death, as the CD is much shorter (in a raid setting... obviously not in pvp lol)
sure, it can be resisted... but thats what feign can cover.... not that aggro is ever a problem any more
<3 my salv buffs
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