I ran Slave Pens last night and was freeze trapping. Sometimes It would last the full length, and sometimes it would break 2 secs after.
I thought I was or someone else was breaking the trap, but I started to really pay attention and pull the trap FAR away from the main group. I'd immediately deselect the target and it would still break and come to me.
Did the recent patch change this or is it still user error? Anyone else having this priblem?
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Traps breaking REALLY earlyFollow
Sounds like a DoT of some kind.
I paid attention to that as well, would a scorpid sting break traps?
I normally pull with a scorpid, I don't know why. I know better than to pull with a Serpent or Viper.
I saw no other DoTs on the mob.
I normally pull with a scorpid, I don't know why. I know better than to pull with a Serpent or Viper.
I saw no other DoTs on the mob.
No, scorpid does not break traps.
Where the mobs higher than you in level? Their chance to resist tends to get higher in that case.
Another thing I have noticed is that trap duration seems to get shorter when the trap already lay around for some time (e.g. whenever I wait for my trap cooldown to be almost over, the 1st trap will often only hold for a few seconds).
However since I have skilled most of those nice trapping talents, resists or early breaks are very seldom.
Where the mobs higher than you in level? Their chance to resist tends to get higher in that case.
Another thing I have noticed is that trap duration seems to get shorter when the trap already lay around for some time (e.g. whenever I wait for my trap cooldown to be almost over, the 1st trap will often only hold for a few seconds).
However since I have skilled most of those nice trapping talents, resists or early breaks are very seldom.
The mobs were around 63 elite. My traps did lay for a bit though, so that may have caused it. They did seem to work better when I would just lay a trap and quickly pull.
When I waited for the warrior to pull was when the traps broke more often.
When I waited for the warrior to pull was when the traps broke more often.
I've also noticed some traps breaking right away or early, i blamed resist or semi resist. Since I'm SV with readiness it was more annoying then anything.
Just the luck of the draw honestly. Some nights I'll have nothing but resists. Others I'll get no resists. Even with the 10% Resist talent for traps it doesn't always help. When you get a full "Resist" as the mob passes over your trap it is rather annoying, I'd much rather prefer it to be trapped for 5 seconds then to resist completely right off the bat.
Best suggestion is to always keep a trap out, and just wait for your cooldowns so you can immediately put another trap down as soon as you pull your target to your first trap. That way even if he breaks, your next trap is already up and ready to trap him again.
Best suggestion is to always keep a trap out, and just wait for your cooldowns so you can immediately put another trap down as soon as you pull your target to your first trap. That way even if he breaks, your next trap is already up and ready to trap him again.
I saw something recently that involved an upcoming patch and making traps break early.
I'm just hoping this is not the future of CC for hunters, if it is, I will be teh sad.
I'm just hoping this is not the future of CC for hunters, if it is, I will be teh sad.
"Place a frost trap that freezes the first enemy that approaches, preventing all action for up to 20 sec. Any damage caused will break the ice. Trap will exist for 60 sec. Only one trap can be active at a time."
Traps can hold a target for UP TO 20 seconds. More if you go into survival a bit.
Nothing is wrong with your trap technique, it's entirely random when some mobs break out. Most of the time you'll get the 20 seconds. Sometimes you'll get 5.
Practice being prepared in lower level instances, and you won't cause wipes in heroics. All the more reason to have some stamina gear in your bags if you notice mobs in a particular instance breaking sooner than expected.
Traps can hold a target for UP TO 20 seconds. More if you go into survival a bit.
Nothing is wrong with your trap technique, it's entirely random when some mobs break out. Most of the time you'll get the 20 seconds. Sometimes you'll get 5.
Practice being prepared in lower level instances, and you won't cause wipes in heroics. All the more reason to have some stamina gear in your bags if you notice mobs in a particular instance breaking sooner than expected.
I am glad I'm not the only one with that problem then. Today in Sethekk Halls one type of mob would break out of my traps immediately. Those weren't resists, but broken traps. No kinds of DoT on the mobs either. Ridiculous for a lvl 70 trap and 68 or 69 mobs, especially since I got the trapping talents again.
You'll probably see the same thing if you try to trap a Felguard in BG or duel. Gets trapped and breaks out almost immediately.
You'll probably see the same thing if you try to trap a Felguard in BG or duel. Gets trapped and breaks out almost immediately.
42 posts
I have spoken with a gm on my server about the whole traps breaking early thing..
I was told that "Traps have been changed and they can break early now"
When i told them that they may want to look into the actual rate that it happens because it seems far to high.. they told me that " it is completely intended.. and any suggestions should be made on the forums"
I then thanked the gm for his involvement in the futher destruction of the usefulness of the already beaten hunter
Thing is now.. the hunters are even less wanted in instances.. what would the group want more.. garenteed cc with a sheep or sap for over 40 seconds..
Or an iffy 26 second max survival trap... in shadow labs today my traps got resisted twice and broke early once... all within like 20 minutes of each other..
Can hunters still trap? are they still usefull in an instance? .... ya but blizzard has just limited the hunter to 1 skilltree for high end instances..
survival is now the only viable option for a hunter...
Edited, Jul 12th 2007 10:07pm by Narutoscryed
I was told that "Traps have been changed and they can break early now"
When i told them that they may want to look into the actual rate that it happens because it seems far to high.. they told me that " it is completely intended.. and any suggestions should be made on the forums"
I then thanked the gm for his involvement in the futher destruction of the usefulness of the already beaten hunter
Thing is now.. the hunters are even less wanted in instances.. what would the group want more.. garenteed cc with a sheep or sap for over 40 seconds..
Or an iffy 26 second max survival trap... in shadow labs today my traps got resisted twice and broke early once... all within like 20 minutes of each other..
Can hunters still trap? are they still usefull in an instance? .... ya but blizzard has just limited the hunter to 1 skilltree for high end instances..
survival is now the only viable option for a hunter...
Edited, Jul 12th 2007 10:07pm by Narutoscryed
I was training south of Shat. with the lost souls and skellitons there and it seemed like every mob in the area, even the draenai were breaking my trap at like 5 sec or so. Really annoying as that is a high add area.
Although traps are a single effect against the mob, they do actually tick over.
Each tick (2 seconds) has the same chance to resist as your other spells.
If it resists then they break the trap.
Each tick (2 seconds) has the same chance to resist as your other spells.
If it resists then they break the trap.
Narutoscryed wrote:
survival is now the only viable option for a hunter...
No, it's not.
Actually I am a survival hunter (at least since a few months now). It is a great treee, but the other trees have their merrits as well.
Traps are not the most important thing of playing a hunter, it is just an aspect.
Yes, survival spec buffs traps and makes it easier to CC in 5man instances (especially in heroics where CC is king), but there are other aspects to the game.
End game raiding BM is currently the No 1 spec (SV is only 2nd best spec there)
Solo PvE BM is currently the best spec (and has been for quite some time.
PvP sees a lot of specs. As far as I know there are very good MM and BM specs for PvP
In 5man instances alll specs can hold their own, even a MM heavy spec will be good there.
Additionally you can get the "best" trapping talents rather early in SV so that if you focus heavily on traps then you can still build a x/y/17 spec. With that you can focus on either BM (ok, you don't get mortal shots from MM, but BM/SV is still a valid spec) or MM and still get entrapment, clever traps and trap mastery.
I'm 41 points into survival and I have only those 3 talents for buffing my traps. I do not see very much resists and early breaks, some yes, many no.
It's just odd that this issue comes up essentially within a day after a patch and people start to notice independently from each other.
I'm saying they messed with it, intentionally or not.
I'm saying they messed with it, intentionally or not.
I just don't understand why they would change trap resists. Did our traps really make us unbalanced? We still were not the best CCers out there. We have a limited CC ability with trapping compared to a rogue sap, stunlock or mage poly.
Have their CC abilities been affected as well? I'm not usually one to cry about a so called nerf, but when they take away from a limited ability in the first place, it gets quite annoying.
Have their CC abilities been affected as well? I'm not usually one to cry about a so called nerf, but when they take away from a limited ability in the first place, it gets quite annoying.
Mobs have been resisting a whole lot since what I think was 2.1. I've had tons of Faerie Fire resists, I've had Growl and Taunt resists on my druid and warrior. Now one of my most important tools has become completely unreliable. Used to be able to say "Sure!" when I was asked to trap a mob. Now it's "Hopefully"
Trash mobs in normal Botanica seem to have odd immunities too. Putting a point back into Wyvern Sting apparently was a waste.
Maybe we're rushing too fast through the TBC content. Might reach the end and not come back and pay for another month unless - somebody - slows us down.
Trash mobs in normal Botanica seem to have odd immunities too. Putting a point back into Wyvern Sting apparently was a waste.
Maybe we're rushing too fast through the TBC content. Might reach the end and not come back and pay for another month unless - somebody - slows us down.
28 posts
I'm on the Thoruim Brotherhood server, and came up with this general build on my own. I can easily CC 2 mobs at once, which rarely needs to be done if you have a good group. I find one freezing, .. pop readiness ... then an AOE 60% frost does the job if anything goes wrong with the plan. This works pretty well if everyone else is doing thier job. You can use the two freezing as well .... depends on the mix. Funny thing is using the Survival/Marksman build I out DPS everyone in my guild other than about 2 or 3 guys. I use readiness to also pop the cool down on Rapid shot, which is a huge boost on boss fights, or whenever. I went with the maxed out cool down reduction on arcane, rather than aimed shot. My attack is almost 1800 unbuffed, and crit is about 27% unbuffed. Typically during a raid my attack is well over 2000, and crit runs about 30% or more. Anywas on boss fights I run with viper, this augmented with Thrill of the hunt will allow you to hit it hard and fast for a real long time. Best build ever.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=VZVVVMZIu0MxfMhVhAo
I gotta laugh sometimes though, because there is really so little expected of Hunters, that if you can only avoid getting everyone kill you are considered some kind of hero or someting, which is a testimant to how many crappy Hunters there are out there. The class is truely easy to play, but very difficult to master, due to the fact that with our abilites there are nearly a million different way for us to get everyone killed ... LOL.
8 posts
Just to add another anecdote to this thread, I ran Arc last night. Not a lot of CC in that instance. The times I did trap, however, did not go well. First pull, attempted to trap, resist. Didn't get a second trap off because the tank jumped on the mob. Whenever we got to the next CCable part, I laid a trap. Resist. Laid another immediately. Resist. Pet tanked the mob until my CD was up, trapped, and it broke within two seconds.
It was so horrible. My mage friend even laughed at me. I'm beginning to loathe the long CD on traps. When hunter CC is good, it's great, but one little snag can really throw you off if it comes at a bad time. For the first time I'm not trusting my own CC in instances anymore. I don't understand why hunters should be given a "tool" this unreliable.
It was so horrible. My mage friend even laughed at me. I'm beginning to loathe the long CD on traps. When hunter CC is good, it's great, but one little snag can really throw you off if it comes at a bad time. For the first time I'm not trusting my own CC in instances anymore. I don't understand why hunters should be given a "tool" this unreliable.
Ran Mana Tombs last night and it wasn't AS BAD, but at some crucial times, it broke on me and we came close to wiping.
Luckily, we had 2 Hunters and we were backing each others traps up when possible. If they are going to reduce the effectiveness of this tool, they really should reduce the cool down. Fear has no cool down, poly doesn't have one, why should our traps?
Luckily, we had 2 Hunters and we were backing each others traps up when possible. If they are going to reduce the effectiveness of this tool, they really should reduce the cool down. Fear has no cool down, poly doesn't have one, why should our traps?
Quote:
If they are going to reduce the effectiveness of this tool, they really should reduce the cool down. Fear has no cool down, poly doesn't have one, why should our traps?
Because you can't have more then one mob feared/sheeped at the same time. Freezing traps offer this kind of freedom, even if it's limited, it still helps out a lot on those tougher pulls with multiple mobs.
There's also the fact that if our traps did not have a cooldown, we could constantly place out any trap we wanted as soon as the global cooldown let us. Could you imagine in pvp with the whole field in Frost Traps? Or 50 some odd snakes cause you kept laying out snake traps? The whole field would be engulfed with a dot if you could constantly place out Explosive traps.
We receive more freedom with our traps with the downside of a cooldown, which we can get down to 20 seconds. All in all this isn't a bad trade off if used properly. Hell we used to have to be out of combat to lay a trap. I for one am glad they took this out. It was very annoying to double trap back then, and impossible to Tripple Trap due to cooldowns, and staying in combat.
You had to lay a trap, pull, make sure some one got aggro on one of the other mobs, Feign Death, wait to get out of combat (usually takes anywhere from 2-5 seconds), hoping that FD didn't resist, and then lay another trap just to double trap mobs. It could be done, but wasn't nearly as efficient as it is now.
The truely sad part about traps is that sometimes you just can't control who triggers the trap.
Having trapped a sheep(ed) target before, it was amusing. Funny part was, it didn't break the sheep and it seemed to stop the count down timer on the sheep spell. It took forever for that sheep to come out of polymorph. Our priest had time to heal everyone and re-mana up. Our tank was dancing with the sheep when it came out of poly. We all laughed.
This was, of course, pre-2.1 and I have no idea what would happen now.
I've noticed my traps breaking really early now in 2.1 and being resisted fairly often, even by mobs lower level than I. Luckly Morris has my back...
Having trapped a sheep(ed) target before, it was amusing. Funny part was, it didn't break the sheep and it seemed to stop the count down timer on the sheep spell. It took forever for that sheep to come out of polymorph. Our priest had time to heal everyone and re-mana up. Our tank was dancing with the sheep when it came out of poly. We all laughed.
This was, of course, pre-2.1 and I have no idea what would happen now.
I've noticed my traps breaking really early now in 2.1 and being resisted fairly often, even by mobs lower level than I. Luckly Morris has my back...
I thought about the infinite trap situation with no cooldown, but I'm sure there could be a way to fix that. I've got a great idea, make our traps work.
How often have you seen Poly break early? I know fear has a chance to break on damage now, but freeze trap already has that. And I thought you could fear moer than one mob?
I know you can't Poly more than one, but I'd almost rather have only one trap at a time that was guaranteed, than hope that your two or three trapped mobs don't break early and jump into the dance.
I guess that's what makes us Hunters, we can't just sheep and forget, we have to plan for the unforeseen trap break. Makes Hunting that much more exciting.
How often have you seen Poly break early? I know fear has a chance to break on damage now, but freeze trap already has that. And I thought you could fear moer than one mob?
I know you can't Poly more than one, but I'd almost rather have only one trap at a time that was guaranteed, than hope that your two or three trapped mobs don't break early and jump into the dance.
I guess that's what makes us Hunters, we can't just sheep and forget, we have to plan for the unforeseen trap break. Makes Hunting that much more exciting.
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And I thought you could fear moer than one mob?
Yes and no. AE fear will fear multiple targets at one time, but it will never last the full duration of just a normal fear. Warlocks have this, so do Priests, but it never lasts to long. Usually just enough to get whatever is on you off, so you can cast another spell or heal.
Now Deathcoil is considered a Terror Effect, so you could have some one Feared and use Deathcoil, but again the duration of Deathcoil is 3 seconds tops? It's very short, and most Warlocks use it as a get out of damage free card so they can set up Fear right after.
However you can't keep more then 1 person feared without the use of AE fear, or Deathcoil. Same goes for Poly, Banish, and Shackle though.
If your trap breaks early -
- scatter shot/intimidate
- pet off-tank
- wing clip and kite
Make sure you get a good chunk of aggro on your target before it hits your trap. If you just use a single autoshot then when the trap breaks, the monster will probably be going after your healer. If you build up a lot of aggro, then it will come after you. That's good, since the healer can heal you but not if he or she is dead. :) Then buy some time until you can retrap.
- scatter shot/intimidate
- pet off-tank
- wing clip and kite
Make sure you get a good chunk of aggro on your target before it hits your trap. If you just use a single autoshot then when the trap breaks, the monster will probably be going after your healer. If you build up a lot of aggro, then it will come after you. That's good, since the healer can heal you but not if he or she is dead. :) Then buy some time until you can retrap.
8 posts
Hmm, it happened again today. A friend and I were messing around in the Auchindoun instances for giggles.
We pulled one of those mobs that spawns adds in Auchenai Crypts. I trapped the add, you know, the ghost guys, and he broke within four seconds. Keep in mind this is a green non-elite we're dealing with.
In Sethekk Halls, we pulled the first two, and I got another trap resist. :( From another green mob. I think that's the first time a green has outright resisted my trap.
Oh well...
We pulled one of those mobs that spawns adds in Auchenai Crypts. I trapped the add, you know, the ghost guys, and he broke within four seconds. Keep in mind this is a green non-elite we're dealing with.
In Sethekk Halls, we pulled the first two, and I got another trap resist. :( From another green mob. I think that's the first time a green has outright resisted my trap.
Oh well...
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