Talents as I level?Follow

This comment goes for any class - Levels 10 to 40 should be a survivability build. Pick a talent that you need right then and there. This is also the time to learn the abilities and limitations of your class. When you get to 40-50, re-spec and pick your tree.


As to your plans. I'm no expert but to start a conversation.....

Everything looks to be enhancement up to level 41, why are you concerned with your mana pool (Ancestral Knowledge). Take those first 5 points and pick up some shield buffs. You'll need them.

Imp. Ghost Wolf?? Imp. Lightning shield?? Guardian Totems and Enhanced Totems???? Try putting some (or all) of that into Elemental. Concussion and Call of Flame are great talents for younger Shammies. Instant damage.


By the time you hit 45 you'll a good feel for your Shammy and will be able to make the decisions based on prsonal experience. Then it's time to re-spec.

Absolutely not. Ancestral Knowledge > Shield Spec, no matter what spec you are going for that 5% more mana will be 10 times more valuable to you than a little extra chance to block with a shield you never equip (in the case of enhancement) or should rarely have to rely on (in the case of elemental or resto)

Once you get 11 points deep in enhance and get a 2 hander you will never want to go back to 1 hand and shield so those points will be redundant, added to that the limitations of our mana pool mean we need all the help we can get.



Whoa wait a minute, first you tell him to forget about Ancestral Knowledge, now you are telling him to put some points in elemental with his further depleted mana pool... just no. An Enhancement/Elemental build is almost never viable except in PvP for what we call a suicide build, and even this is not viable till at least 49.

Imp Ghost Wolf is not "necessary", but it is useful and convenient, turning primary escape spell into a 1 second cast instead of a 3 second cast can really help, in concert with a stoneclaw totem this has saved my a$$ more times than I can count. Particularly at lower levels when you don't have all that much survivability.
Imp. Lightning shield is great IF YOU REMEMBER TO USE IT. Most times I find I cast it before a fight then forget to recast it when it runs out, added to that it is pretty mana expensive and by the time you've thrown a few shocks you often can't justify the mana cost of recast. It can be a nice little DPS boost but probably not something to stress about (post 60 you will get water shield which restores mana when you are hit, once that comes you will never use LS again).

Guardian and Enhancing Totems are both cool, but you are better off choosing just one of the two. Take Guardian if you tend to solo a lot for the added survivability. Enhancing if you are more group minded. At higher levels there is no real competition, Enhancing Totems all the way.

My sequence would be as follows:

10-14: Ancestral Knowledge

15-19: Thundering Strikes (You could go 3 points then the 2 in GW if you plan on PvPing at 19)

20: 2-Handed Axe/Mace

21-22: Imp GW (or the final 2 points in TS if you PvP'd at 19)

23-24: Guardian Totems or Enhancing Totems (I outlined how to choose between these above)

25-29: Flurry

30: Spirit Weapons

31-33: Elemental Weapons

34: At this time you have a loose point. I'd probably throw it in Imp Weapon Totems but it's up to you.

35-39: Weapon Mastery

40: StormStrike!!!

At this point we have to make some choices, Dual wield is an option but gearing for it is not very good at this point, I wouldn't bother till outland personally. Mobs start hitting harder and faster around this level so throwing some points in resto can be pretty useful.

If you choose DW the progression would be: DW; DWS; UR; SR...then on to resto.

If you choose the resto path the progression would be:

41-45: Imp Healing Wave

46-50: Totemic Focus

51-55: Healing Focus (This is a compulsory talent IMO)

56-60: Tidal Mastery

61: Natures Swiftness (Another necessary, the only PvE build that should be without it if a 41 point dual wield enhancement build)

At this point you have a good strong build that will allow you to deal out good melee damage and still gives you a lot of support viability (though it may be hard to main heal an instance you will be able to offheal and/or take over if the healer goes down) which is what Shaman is all about.

9 points remaining to spend and really up to you where you put them, dual wield is viable once you reach these levels and can get the gear, but if you take that path you will have to give up Natures Swiftness which IMO is invaluable for the 60-70 leveling grind. I'm a dual wielder myself but didn't spec in it till I hit 70 and got the gear.

My personal advice to maximise your usefulness to groups and the ease of leveling would be to stick some more in resto for things like Healing Way and Natures Guidance and Ancestral Healing, this will make you a fairly viable healer for any of the pre 70 content.

All of that said (and sorry it took so long) if you want a truly viable DPS/Healer Hybrid build go Elemental/Resto. :-)

Bored and at work and thought I'd post the builds I use.

This is my Enhancement/Resto crossover, I used this to level with but don't find it really viable at 70 as you are not good enough at anything to excel.

This is my full enhancement build that I use now (most of the time anyway). It is a high sustained DPS build that lacks heavily in survivability. Not recommended for PvP or Solo PvE but great if you can guarantee you will almost always be grouped (as long as you can watch your aggro).

This is my Elemental/Resto build which is IMO the most viable DPS/Healing hybrid option available to us at endgame. Remarkably good sustainability and a lot of fun to play.

This is a PvP Enhancement/Elemental suicide build. The idea being you will die, but you'll take 2 or 3 with you. Take a big slow 2 hander, stick WF on it and shock shock shock.

Survivability Build means that when you level, sit back and think about some of the problems you had. Think about your style of play and the people you might be running with. Do I need that extra lightning damage, a faster shock or are to many mobs hitting me? Get what you need at that particular point of the game.

Ancestral Knowledge adds 1-5% mana IIRC. Let's say a 500 point mana pool and I'm going to add 5% to that......25 mana points! Even when your level 70 with a 7000 point pool the bonus is only 350.

For a young shammy, a shield is almost a necessity. You can't DW and you don't have 2H so use a shield. Also, a shammy with decent gear and a decent healer can off tank and sometimes main tank.

His original spec was about 90% Enh and 10% Ele. That implies he's planning on fighting and not being a caster. A fighter is going to need shield, toughness and anticipation. To go back to my original theme, once you level up to 40 or 50 you can re-spec. Until then, it's all about surviving and developing.

BTW: My Shammy, Leandraa, is Level 68 with a 23/36/0 build and I'm loving it. Working on upgrading my gear.
Check her out: http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Exodar&n=Leandraar=Exodar&n=Leandraa

You get a 2 hander at level 20, if you are having trouble with survivability before that perhaps you need to roll another class. TBH by the time you have all 5 points in shield spec you are already level 14, so you get the full benefit of it for a grand total of 6 levels then never benefit from it again. It is useless, take ancestral knowledge.

EvilShenanigans, love your Enhancement/Resto build, gonna have to give that a go, takes out a couple of more redundant talent from my build (Imp LS being the main one) and looks supremely viable. I might keep 3 points in Totemic Focus though instead of Ancestral Healing, I tend to re-place my totems regularly and change them as circumstances change, so the reduced cost works a treat for me.

Seth...please try to keep in mind that the following is honestly not intended as a flame. I am having trouble figuring out what your build is for, are you using it for solo grinding, instancing, PvP?

If it is for PvE I really think those points in Elemental would be more effective in Resto (either that or put more in elemental and put the points from enhancement in resto), whether you solo or instance it would make you so much more survivable and valuable. Trying to gear yourself for the kind of build you are going for is just too difficult and will either leave you with not enough health or not enough mana or both because you will be sacrificing int and stam to try and get enough hit, crit and AP as well as spell crit and spell power... i honestly feel you are spreading it too thin.

If it is for PvP then you have left out some of the essentials like Eye of the Storm, and IMO Convection is just SO much more valuable than Call of Fire and Elemental Devastation. EM is one of those trick talents that looks awesome but actually sucks... the problem is by the time you have enough spell crit to get it to proc regularly you have sacrificed more melee crit than it gives you.

Also, even if we go with the idea that Shield Spec is worthwhile at low levels (which I still say it is not) it is completely useless at high levels and why you would put those points there along with the point in 2 handers AND the points in dual wield is beyond me.

I know we are hybrids but trying to be a "jack-of-all-trades" to that extent just gimps us. You need to try to specialize a little more. TBH with the gold to be made in outland, and the cap on respec costs that we now have it is realistic to respec regularly depending on what you are doing, trying to make an all round build for everything just doesn't work.

No doubt, I like my shield too, I have a really nice one from Botanica (no-one else in the party could equip a shield, don't worry guys no ninja'ing here) and I use it often enough but I still wouldn't waste the talent points on it.

[quote]
As far as moving my Ele points to Resto. No Way In Hell. The elemental is easily half of my ****************

It's half your ******* because half your gear is elemental, as a result you are hitting for less physically, and you are hitting for lees with spells than you would if you went full elemental, and I'll guarantee you are hitting for less overall than you would if you focused on one or the other. The gear issue will become bigger when you hit 70 and start collecting a dungeon set because you will have to collect 2 sets and the pieces are the same slots so you will have to start sacrificing set bonuses.

For Dual Wield you are going to be aiming for at least 150 hit rating, 1k AP and 20% melee crit, otherwise it's just not going to be viable for endgame, you will not achieve that it you are trying to gear yourself for elemental viability as well. It may work to an extent while you are leveling but for endgame it's just not going to cut the mustard.

Edited, Jun 20th 2007 4:07am by SunSoarer

The enhance tree is so wrong I don't know where to start.

You are describing your build as "Heres my PvP/PvE/Instance/Anything" and yet you have left out almost all the most important talents for both group PvE and PvP.

First of all you don't have 2 handers, I don't know how you got to 70 without them and PvPing without a 2 hander is just ridiculous. The main thing we bring to PvP is burst, that means a slow 2 handed axe or mace with WF is the way to go for PvP. Always has been and always will.

Imp GW is also extremely useful for PvP (especially pre 40 but even afterwards) as it is our best "escape" option. Anticipation and Toughness are not completely useless but neither are they particularly useful. They are survival talents but even with them you will never have true survivability. It's just not the way enhancement is designed, if you want survival spec into resto some or put some extra points in elemental to maximise burst damage and use the "kill it before it kills you" tactic that enhancement is made for.

For group PvE viability we need to focus on maximising the buffs we bring to a group, because they are what gives us an edge over the pure dps classes. Enhancing Totems and Imp Weapon Totems are essentials if you plan on grouping regularly.

TBH it is also not effective to spec into all 3 tree's pick a primary and secondary tree and stick with them. The jack of all trades approach just isn't viable.

On that note trying to design an all round build for 70 is also kinda silly, money is so easy to make and since 2.0 respec costs are capped at 50g (about half a days daily's). Use a PvP build for PvP and a PvE build for PvE, a crossover build just makes you average at both and average = damn near useless at 70.