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WoW Lost 600k Subscribers, down to 11.4MFollow
Honestly, I'm fine with killing new villains, as long as they stop making the good guys go bad.
IDrownFish wrote:
Honestly, I'm fine with killing new villains, as long as they stop making the good guys go bad.
@#%^ you, Daredevil.
Edited, May 18th 2011 11:45pm by lolgaxe
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
Jallil wrote:
Just on a side note i think blizz had it right in BC for difficulty of raids and heroics they were difficult but not impossible. You had your difficult mechanics but they usually would not one shot the player.
Yeah I think bc definately had the right balance as far as challenge go. I was only raiding casually in bc and I didn't mind being all over the new content - because the rest of the game was so fun. These days it seems the only way to get fun, challenging pve content is to level as quickly as possible and get in to the latest endgame. You don't get people doing older tier raids because it's so easy to skip straight to the latest stuff. Removing attunements had a lot to do with that. When people were doing tier 6 content our guild was still having a blast with tier 4 content and getting our kara key was half the fun. Not to mention the fact that it forced us to be appropriately geared and skilled before starting raids. You didn't have people hitting max level one day and jumping in to endgame the next with no clue about working in a group.
And levelling has become an absolute joke as far as challenge goes.
selebrin wrote:
Alexstraza's more likely to die than turn evil.
soneil wrote:
Yeah I think bc definately had the right balance as far as challenge go. I was only raiding casually in bc and I didn't mind being all over the new content - because the rest of the game was so fun. These days it seems the only way to get fun, challenging pve content is to level as quickly as possible and get in to the latest endgame. You don't get people doing older tier raids because it's so easy to skip straight to the latest stuff. Removing attunements had a lot to do with that. When people were doing tier 6 content our guild was still having a blast with tier 4 content and getting our kara key was half the fun. Not to mention the fact that it forced us to be appropriately geared and skilled before starting raids. You didn't have people hitting max level one day and jumping in to endgame the next with no clue about working in a group.
And levelling has become an absolute joke as far as challenge goes.
I agree with most of this. I think that you have far too many people looking at entire sections of the game as purely stepping stones - to be passed over as quickly as possible. (Sub 85, Regulars, Heroics, Raid Tier 1, Raid Tier 2, etc...)
Putting a gear limit (iLvl) on entering heroics with the LFD tool was a sign of the problem. They recognize that you CAN do heroics without 333 gear. They realize that bad players will use the LFD tool to quickly enter heroics - thus making the LFD tool the horrible experience it was during the opening 2 months of this expac. But rather than fix the problem - they put a band-aid on it. You can't use the LFD tool until you hit 333 gear - which reasonably means most average to slightly below average players could complete the heroics.
They haven't addressed the problems:
1. Players have been spoon fed content and the skill level has fallen off.
2. Players have skipped content that would have taught them stuff.
3. Players feel they are entitled to be at end game.
A perfect example of this is Naxx. Really good players hated it because it was re-hashed and they were not challenged. Bad players had never really done Naxx, but didn't want to appear bad. So they bashed Naxx for being too easy or basically repeated what they heard on the O-Boards or from better players... The bad players, if they attended with a similar group of people (meaning they weren't boosted through) could have/would have learned something. The kiting of 'zombie-chow' was important for frost mages or hunters to learn. But the baddies never did Naxx at proper gear levels, they were boosted through, or they outright skipped Naxx.
The same could be said for bosses like Grob. Was he a simple Kite, Kill Adds, collect loot fight.... Yeah. But when 'tunnel-vision the mage' stands in the center and drops his cloud - that simple fight just got a lot harder. People just skipped this stuff. Or they did it with such an OP gear set that it was trivial.
IMO - you should be rewarded a BOA token for completing content. You should have to attune for heroics and recieve a BOA 'key'. You should have to clear every tier. People in the united states use 4 coins and about 6 pieces of paper currency = WoW players can figure out more than 2 types of currency. Rewarding Justice points in heroics is fine, but having justice points buy Tier 10 equipment during patch 4.0, then using the same heroic-justice points to buy tier 11 in patch 4.1 is stupid. It makes the entire tier of 10 - completely useless. If they need to make the names of the points more self- explanatory -- Do it. (Naxxram Point of honor, Ulduarian token of justice, Stupid arena badge of courage, Citadellian Coin)
Nerf content 4.0 when content 4.1 comes out. If baddies can't beat Cho'Gall with a 30% buff - they shouldn't be in the next tier. Do not make heroics = tier 10 Prep, then suddenly make the same heroic = tier 11 prep.
Do not force people to attune to everything once they have done it on one character. Once you have attuned your main - you are done. Does this mean some DPS will attune, then go on to be lousy tanks... Yeah, possibly, but it's a better solution than the BS we have now.
Currently we are catering to the lowest common denominator. If it's easy for bad players to get into raids, it's stoopid easy for good players.
*I don't claim to be all that great. I'm probably a little above average. When I tank (Paly) I keep healbot up because holding agro and dancing around isn't hard for me, so I can go the extra mile and heal, cleanse, HoP, LoH, etc... But when things get hard... all that goes out the window and I struggle like everyone else. I started too late in TBC to raid, but cleared all of Wrath (though some time off did slow that and cause me to clear IC after some of the nerfs.) I haven't cleared the current content - due to taking time off (read: quitting).
#107REDACTED,
Posted: May 19 2011 at 9:42 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) That is still at least 5 times as much as any other MMO. Including Aion.
You make a lot of good points Borsuk, but I do think it's unfair to claim that anyone who hadn't seen Naxx 1.0 is a bad player. That's not even on par to saying that anyone who didn't kill LK is a bad player considering how much ICC got nerfed. I'm pretty sure Naxx 1.0 never got nerfed prior to it being remade for Wrath, and back in Vanilla you DID have to gear up in every raid to move on to the next.
I don't really like that idea, but I would fully support some sort of attunement system like there was in BC. I think that would help with a lot of the issues we're having with the bad players. The point system as it is currently just helps you gear up your alts faster, and I don't think that's a bad thing. Hell, even with the troll dungeons, my priest got geared up a lot faster than my druid did.
I don't really like that idea, but I would fully support some sort of attunement system like there was in BC. I think that would help with a lot of the issues we're having with the bad players. The point system as it is currently just helps you gear up your alts faster, and I don't think that's a bad thing. Hell, even with the troll dungeons, my priest got geared up a lot faster than my druid did.
Perhaps "Bad" is a bit overly harsh. Maybe saying "players who need to learn" is more on the mark.
4 posts
Why 11+ million subscribers????
Do we count the accounts on china too? Where you get to pay them by the hour?
What kind of an "active" account is that???
Most of these accounts are used for gold farming anyway! The game died the moment it decided to do vertical expansions vs horizontal ones. It nerfed good players and eventually drove them out of the game.
Item acquisition is the only thing that drives it. It destroys all the fun playing it this way.
Either you go fully prepared or you don't get to play at all. Study the fights, farm the hcs for some basic gear and then DEVOTE your self to some greedy groups called guilds to be their slave primarily than a fellow partner in the game.
DKPs and a fascistic way or running the guilds is the right way to become obsolete!
And as if that was not enough they destroyed pvp too! No arenas? No PVP for you!
Great! What a wonderful way to make battlegrounds useless!
They're feeding them selfs from new gamers at the time..their time will come eventually!
Do we count the accounts on china too? Where you get to pay them by the hour?
What kind of an "active" account is that???
Most of these accounts are used for gold farming anyway! The game died the moment it decided to do vertical expansions vs horizontal ones. It nerfed good players and eventually drove them out of the game.
Item acquisition is the only thing that drives it. It destroys all the fun playing it this way.
Either you go fully prepared or you don't get to play at all. Study the fights, farm the hcs for some basic gear and then DEVOTE your self to some greedy groups called guilds to be their slave primarily than a fellow partner in the game.
DKPs and a fascistic way or running the guilds is the right way to become obsolete!
And as if that was not enough they destroyed pvp too! No arenas? No PVP for you!
Great! What a wonderful way to make battlegrounds useless!
They're feeding them selfs from new gamers at the time..their time will come eventually!
If you dislike the game that much, don't play it. Most of the people that post here still play the game, and we like it. You're welcome to your opinion, but don't expect your opinion to be welcome here.
velerefontis wrote:
Why 11+ million subscribers????
Do we count the accounts on china too? Where you get to pay them by the hour?
What kind of an "active" account is that???
Most of these accounts are used for gold farming anyway! The game died the moment it decided to do vertical expansions vs horizontal ones. It nerfed good players and eventually drove them out of the game.
Item acquisition is the only thing that drives it. It destroys all the fun playing it this way.
Either you go fully prepared or you don't get to play at all. Study the fights, farm the hcs for some basic gear and then DEVOTE your self to some greedy groups called guilds to be their slave primarily than a fellow partner in the game.
DKPs and a fascistic way or running the guilds is the right way to become obsolete!
And as if that was not enough they destroyed pvp too! No arenas? No PVP for you!
Great! What a wonderful way to make battlegrounds useless!
They're feeding them selfs from new gamers at the time..their time will come eventually!
Do we count the accounts on china too? Where you get to pay them by the hour?
What kind of an "active" account is that???
Most of these accounts are used for gold farming anyway! The game died the moment it decided to do vertical expansions vs horizontal ones. It nerfed good players and eventually drove them out of the game.
Item acquisition is the only thing that drives it. It destroys all the fun playing it this way.
Either you go fully prepared or you don't get to play at all. Study the fights, farm the hcs for some basic gear and then DEVOTE your self to some greedy groups called guilds to be their slave primarily than a fellow partner in the game.
DKPs and a fascistic way or running the guilds is the right way to become obsolete!
And as if that was not enough they destroyed pvp too! No arenas? No PVP for you!
Great! What a wonderful way to make battlegrounds useless!
They're feeding them selfs from new gamers at the time..their time will come eventually!
That's half the fun.
Quote:
DKPs and a fascistic way or running the guilds is the right way to become obsolete!
This rant is Greek to me.
Rhodekylle wrote:
Quote:
DKPs and a fascistic way or running the guilds is the right way to become obsolete!
This rant is Greek to me.
This is exactly why you're a sage and ranty boy is a default. Rate up.
lol, a new word! Fascistic. So that's like the act of being fascist. Oddly enough, it actually is a word. Looks like gibberish.
I quit over making a bad decision, I started out in cata doing archaeology, going for the crunchy epics and the staff(mage), day in and day out sometimes 14hrs a day, while my gear never progressed, everyone elses did, the plan was to get the staff and then get gear.
After over 2 months of everyday digging, I hadn't gotten any weapons or the trinket or the bug, nothing impressive, but everyone else was raiding, obtaining good gear, and I felt cheated. People's attitudes now is if you aren't an instant expert going fresh into a dungeon then they kick you.
Blizzard is finally granting the Elitist echelons wishes, (Weed out the casuals/non-hardcores).
Also 30k-50k for Basic Cata epics was a retarded idea, that caught on like wildfire. I might rejoin one day, but I think changing the entire world was a bad idea, just add new zones. :(
After over 2 months of everyday digging, I hadn't gotten any weapons or the trinket or the bug, nothing impressive, but everyone else was raiding, obtaining good gear, and I felt cheated. People's attitudes now is if you aren't an instant expert going fresh into a dungeon then they kick you.
Blizzard is finally granting the Elitist echelons wishes, (Weed out the casuals/non-hardcores).
Also 30k-50k for Basic Cata epics was a retarded idea, that caught on like wildfire. I might rejoin one day, but I think changing the entire world was a bad idea, just add new zones. :(
The epics are down to thousands of gold now. Still way more than I'd want to pay, considering how easy you can get epics from Loot'Aman and Zul'Piñata, but at least ordinary players (like me) can afford it - if they save up.
Also, ever since the expansion was launched, Blizzard has done whatever they could to move away from the "hardcore" approach. They realized that it didn't appeal to the vocal majority, so they're changing it back. Only thing left of the "hardcore" style is the healing classes, which are still crap, and some boss encounters which will wipe a group if you press the wrong button.
Also, ever since the expansion was launched, Blizzard has done whatever they could to move away from the "hardcore" approach. They realized that it didn't appeal to the vocal majority, so they're changing it back. Only thing left of the "hardcore" style is the healing classes, which are still crap, and some boss encounters which will wipe a group if you press the wrong button.
Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
jaysgsl wrote:
I don't remember many posts about how fun Lich was, either.
There were quite a few "Lich sucks, bring back BC" posts.
There were quite a few "Lich is too easy, we're full T7 already and it's been a week" threads.
"Uld hard modes are too hard and easy modes are too easy."
"T9 is a joke."
"T10 is a joke and looks terrible."
"Way to rehash content Blizzard."
"There's nothing to do at endgame except grind 4 versions of the same raid and do dailies."
Are we noticing a trend?
There were quite a few "Lich sucks, bring back BC" posts.
There were quite a few "Lich is too easy, we're full T7 already and it's been a week" threads.
"Uld hard modes are too hard and easy modes are too easy."
"T9 is a joke."
"T10 is a joke and looks terrible."
"Way to rehash content Blizzard."
"There's nothing to do at endgame except grind 4 versions of the same raid and do dailies."
Are we noticing a trend?
I never complained about Wrath personally. I loved all incarnations of WoW up until Cataclysm. I still play because I have some buds that play and I'm hoping Blizz will turn it around. I do not enjoy Cataclysm though outside of the newly redesigned 1-60. I'll admit, I haven't done any raiding this expansion. The raids don't look interesting to me at all. I ran the 5s over and over again in my 30+ minute queue and got a couple toons to iL351-353ish, but I really have no desire to continue so I roll alts. I think Cataclysm needs a little less fire or something. It's just not appealing to me. Maybe I don't like red?
A lot of my story has been brought up in bits by others already.
The sub numbers don't reflect people who keep their subs but stopped playing. I logged on for the first time since . .February? last night. I had been bored as hell with WoW for awhile before that too. And while I was never omghardcore, I played daily - usually for hours - for the 2+ years straight since I started. I didn't "quit." I never really even complained; never said anything to my guild. Just one day, I got busy or something and didn't log on. And the next day I just didn't really feel like it. A few months go by . . .
I know, I know, to the original topic at hand, Blizz doesn't care because I'm still paying them (the $30/mo for mine & wife's accounts is a non-issue so keeping them up seemed less hassle if/when we came back than canceling) but the reasoning for non-play factors in the same and probably contributes to many who *did* cancel.
I don't know if it's just me, or if it's the game changes/additions, but quite simply, Cataclysm bores me. I got my 5 of my 7 80's to 85 quickly. I really dislike the way the zones are entirely linear. Yes, the phasing storylines are cool and yes, they do give kind of a neat sense of accomplishment after repelling each zone's BigBad and all, but at the same time it completely eliminates any sort of choice one has in how and where to level. You can't just decide "oh I'll do this hub in this zone and go over here for a bit."
And after leveling the Nth toon through the exact same zones in the exact same order, it gets real boring real fast.
So we move on to end-game. Start off by running regular dungeons. But only 4 of them. I got so sick of Lost City and Grim Batol within about a month of Cata's release that I *still* don't want to go back in. In fact, I really don't like most of the endgame dungeons I've seen. It's not that they're too hard or too easy. I just don't like them. For one, they seem to take for-freaking-ever. If I can't get a guild run together (which, before I disappeared, I usually couldn't) I had to sit in queue for 40-ish minutes to the same friggin dungeon for the umpteenth time and spend at least an hour running it (assuming it went at least marginally well) to get . . .absolutely nothing out of it.
I don't know what it is exactly, and I'm not even trying to complain really. In Wrath I could run heroics for hours and hours on end every day and have fun doing it. In Cata, I just don't want to go in them.
Leveling professions seems to cost far more than I could seem to make out of them so, while I was doing it because, well I have these profs I should level them, right?, I got kind of sick of spending 2-300g/day to buy stuff for the JC daily so I could make a gem I couldn't *give* away. I mean, I have probably 50k across toons on my main server so it's not a big deal - just seemed stupid to me.
And if people are requiring Vent, researching bosses via vids, etc. for heroics (which they were), I didn't even want to consider raiding. The handful of heroics I had tried before my leave took around 3-4 hours each, and probably about 75% of the ones tried were never even finished either due to flat quitting or time constraints.
I found none of this either fun or interesting. Just time consuming. And for generally very little in return.
So for a while I kind of laid off my "mains" for a bit and made some (more) alts. I figured I'd go back and try horde again and made some goblins. I made another hunter (an orc). Actually I bounced around several different servers looking for a "horde home base" so I actually leveled probably another 20 or so toons to at least 40 before deciding on a server I thought I liked. This didn't take nearly as long as it sounds like it should because leveling is so incredibly lol-ez-mode now. Not necessarily bad, it just is. But somewhere in all my bouncing around and leveling toons (which was an absolute blast honestly) I realized . .umm ok, so wtf am I going to do with all these toons when they get bigger? I'm going to level them all to 80, then groan my way to 85 and park them because I don't want to do anything at 85?
As I said, I can't pinpoint exactly why I don't like the stuff. I don't find it hard. Hell I logged on my hunter last night, who was never a main and I hardly ever played, got into a new guild my wife had gotten into awhile back with a couple r/l acquaintances, and without knowing/remembering my rotation or even what half my buttons do managed to pull over 10k dps and cleared his first (I think) heroic while the other dps were pulling 1.3k & 4.5k, while my wife tanked at 6-ishk and amy "new" guild was astounded by how I was getting those numbers. I didn't feel like I was doing well. I felt bumbling and confused and subpar. But it didn't matter. We cleared everything no sweat.
So what's the point then? If I can go away for 3-4 months and hop back on to faceroll everything with a "forgotten" toon without even knowing what my buttons do, then why bother working on anything?
Here's my problem though, and I think somebody else brought this up as well. I don't really have anything else I feel like playing that much. In the last few months I picked up Civilization V and have replaced most of my WoW hours with that but it's getting kind of boring already. Picked up Tony Hawk Proving Ground and have mostly cleared that now over the past couple of weeks. Plus, with 5 people in the house I can't hog the TV like I can my computer lol. New Elder Scrolls doesn't come out til Nov . . .
I will admit that playing last night was fun. I don't have that urge to stay on for hours grinding this-n-that but I probably will be logging on at least a bit here and there just to meander around. I have learned now, however, that whatever I do or don't do in game really doesn't matter that much. Grind, don't grind; get rep or don't; leave for months on end or play daily . . I think my dps was actually higher last night than it was when I was on for hours a day and researching every spec and class. I ran about 5 dungeons and was far far ahead on recount every time having near no clue what I was doing.
So I guess I'll keep my subscription rolling for awhile at least to hop on every now and then for kicks. But I can easily see why a lot of people may have left or cut back.
The sub numbers don't reflect people who keep their subs but stopped playing. I logged on for the first time since . .February? last night. I had been bored as hell with WoW for awhile before that too. And while I was never omghardcore, I played daily - usually for hours - for the 2+ years straight since I started. I didn't "quit." I never really even complained; never said anything to my guild. Just one day, I got busy or something and didn't log on. And the next day I just didn't really feel like it. A few months go by . . .
I know, I know, to the original topic at hand, Blizz doesn't care because I'm still paying them (the $30/mo for mine & wife's accounts is a non-issue so keeping them up seemed less hassle if/when we came back than canceling) but the reasoning for non-play factors in the same and probably contributes to many who *did* cancel.
I don't know if it's just me, or if it's the game changes/additions, but quite simply, Cataclysm bores me. I got my 5 of my 7 80's to 85 quickly. I really dislike the way the zones are entirely linear. Yes, the phasing storylines are cool and yes, they do give kind of a neat sense of accomplishment after repelling each zone's BigBad and all, but at the same time it completely eliminates any sort of choice one has in how and where to level. You can't just decide "oh I'll do this hub in this zone and go over here for a bit."
And after leveling the Nth toon through the exact same zones in the exact same order, it gets real boring real fast.
So we move on to end-game. Start off by running regular dungeons. But only 4 of them. I got so sick of Lost City and Grim Batol within about a month of Cata's release that I *still* don't want to go back in. In fact, I really don't like most of the endgame dungeons I've seen. It's not that they're too hard or too easy. I just don't like them. For one, they seem to take for-freaking-ever. If I can't get a guild run together (which, before I disappeared, I usually couldn't) I had to sit in queue for 40-ish minutes to the same friggin dungeon for the umpteenth time and spend at least an hour running it (assuming it went at least marginally well) to get . . .absolutely nothing out of it.
I don't know what it is exactly, and I'm not even trying to complain really. In Wrath I could run heroics for hours and hours on end every day and have fun doing it. In Cata, I just don't want to go in them.
Leveling professions seems to cost far more than I could seem to make out of them so, while I was doing it because, well I have these profs I should level them, right?, I got kind of sick of spending 2-300g/day to buy stuff for the JC daily so I could make a gem I couldn't *give* away. I mean, I have probably 50k across toons on my main server so it's not a big deal - just seemed stupid to me.
And if people are requiring Vent, researching bosses via vids, etc. for heroics (which they were), I didn't even want to consider raiding. The handful of heroics I had tried before my leave took around 3-4 hours each, and probably about 75% of the ones tried were never even finished either due to flat quitting or time constraints.
I found none of this either fun or interesting. Just time consuming. And for generally very little in return.
So for a while I kind of laid off my "mains" for a bit and made some (more) alts. I figured I'd go back and try horde again and made some goblins. I made another hunter (an orc). Actually I bounced around several different servers looking for a "horde home base" so I actually leveled probably another 20 or so toons to at least 40 before deciding on a server I thought I liked. This didn't take nearly as long as it sounds like it should because leveling is so incredibly lol-ez-mode now. Not necessarily bad, it just is. But somewhere in all my bouncing around and leveling toons (which was an absolute blast honestly) I realized . .umm ok, so wtf am I going to do with all these toons when they get bigger? I'm going to level them all to 80, then groan my way to 85 and park them because I don't want to do anything at 85?
As I said, I can't pinpoint exactly why I don't like the stuff. I don't find it hard. Hell I logged on my hunter last night, who was never a main and I hardly ever played, got into a new guild my wife had gotten into awhile back with a couple r/l acquaintances, and without knowing/remembering my rotation or even what half my buttons do managed to pull over 10k dps and cleared his first (I think) heroic while the other dps were pulling 1.3k & 4.5k, while my wife tanked at 6-ishk and amy "new" guild was astounded by how I was getting those numbers. I didn't feel like I was doing well. I felt bumbling and confused and subpar. But it didn't matter. We cleared everything no sweat.
So what's the point then? If I can go away for 3-4 months and hop back on to faceroll everything with a "forgotten" toon without even knowing what my buttons do, then why bother working on anything?
Here's my problem though, and I think somebody else brought this up as well. I don't really have anything else I feel like playing that much. In the last few months I picked up Civilization V and have replaced most of my WoW hours with that but it's getting kind of boring already. Picked up Tony Hawk Proving Ground and have mostly cleared that now over the past couple of weeks. Plus, with 5 people in the house I can't hog the TV like I can my computer lol. New Elder Scrolls doesn't come out til Nov . . .
I will admit that playing last night was fun. I don't have that urge to stay on for hours grinding this-n-that but I probably will be logging on at least a bit here and there just to meander around. I have learned now, however, that whatever I do or don't do in game really doesn't matter that much. Grind, don't grind; get rep or don't; leave for months on end or play daily . . I think my dps was actually higher last night than it was when I was on for hours a day and researching every spec and class. I ran about 5 dungeons and was far far ahead on recount every time having near no clue what I was doing.
So I guess I'll keep my subscription rolling for awhile at least to hop on every now and then for kicks. But I can easily see why a lot of people may have left or cut back.
Pantherfern wrote:
So I guess I'll keep my subscription rolling for awhile at least to hop on every now and then for kicks. But I can easily see why a lot of people may have left or cut back.
I have to say that 8 New Tamable Pets really got my attention, coming up soon.
I can't imagine that steamrolling heroics would be "fun" but that's just my opinion. Not that I necessarily need a challenge out of heroics, but steamrolling them is just boring.
Wonder Gem PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
I can't imagine that steamrolling heroics would be "fun" but that's just my opinion. Not that I necessarily need a challenge out of heroics, but steamrolling them is just boring.
I agree. Heroics through most of Wrath (the 2nd half or so especially) were complete steamrolls. Was it fun? Meh, not really I guess although I did really like a lot of the dungeons on their own.
But it was a means to an end to get badges. But they were quick.
Now I need points to gear up still. They are not quick.
Where before I could pop home for lunch and get probably 2 heroics done, now I'd be lucky to even be out of a queue and into a dungeon in that time. It's not a matter of difficulty but rather time v. reward I guess.
I agree that the time for heroics can be frustrating. My comment was more directed at Rawr than you. 
Ya know, though, I pulled my Priest up through 85 recently. Had a small struggle getting his broke *** up in chanting and gear to do heroics. By the time I was able to afford a lot of Justice pieces, I had already gotten equivalent pieces from the dungeons themselves. End up just buying shadow set pieces with justice now (or replacing my perfectly good pieces with more holy looking justice peices with similar stats).
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