I've been a long time EQ1 player and I'm thinking about permanently switching to EQ2. As a person that loves to role play a paladin and "good" races/classes I am slightly worried about the nerf bat with the new combat changes. I've been primarily finishing up on EQ1 (achieving my personal goals). I currently 2-box an EQ2 level 19 cleric and level 19 paladin.
My main question: Is the nerf bat with the new combat system going to ruin the paladin class in that they no longer can fulfill the role of main tank at the upper levels?
I’m extremely worried about this for this was an enormous problem in EQ1. I swear the SOE development team really had it in for this class. Even when you obtained all of your mandatory AAs the class still was primarily designated the role of off-tank within a raid. The DPS and HP simply were not there to make this a viable tanking class.
I really liked the concept in EQ2 that there were 4 main categories of characters. Any of the warrior classes (in theory) were supposed to be able to fulfill the tank role within a group or raid. This was the initial goal from the very beginning development effort. Is SOE still holding true to their original design concepts? Has the nerf bat hit so hard as to dramatically alter one of the primary foundational goals?
As I start to permanently play EQ2 I definitely want to think of the long term and create characters that are viable for raiding at level 50. I want a character that will take a lead role in a raid and not be stymied into the function of secondary support. Does the paladin still have this function, or is it time to re-roll and choose another character entirely?
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A dedicated player like yourself will have little trouble overcoming the changes that have occured for our class. I play a level 33 Paladin and have been playing since February (slow leveler) and have seen many different changes in that time period, most for the better.
Not everyone agrees with any of the changes that have been made since EQ2 went live, especially those people who the changes affect most. I'm still digesting LU13 and the changes to our class, but I always approach a change/update/modification with the mindset that at the very least SOE developers think it is the best decision for the game as a whole.
Some of the changes are things that I have thought about before and am surprised to find that the developers were apparently thinking the same thing. For example, while I enjoyed special class abilities ever 10 levels or so, that were special versions of regular spells/abilities (I especially loved the 2 handed attack that healed me), I wondered why they just didn't let us pick a spell and have it be Master II quality.
I like the idea of stances very much and find that it adds a nice bit of flavor to the strategy department. Depending on what I'm fighting and wether or not I am soloing or in a group, I will adjust my stance accordingly.
While making the encounters tougher created a knee-jerk reaction, in most people, of disfavor (heck, even I get perturbed at being smacked around by a level 23 ^^^ Griffon add, where as I use to take on 3 at once), I think it is also for the better. I believe the challenging fights will create a more rewarding experience, especially when we eventually achieve victory. When people first played Shinobi ( an extremely difficult 8 bit era game) most didn't give up, they just tried harder.
As far as tanking goes, I have long believed that Paladins make great tanks, but make the best support tanks and that hasn't changed since LU13. In almost every group I have been in, I have usually ended up being the main tank. It is so rare that I don't main tank, that when the exception occurs, I have to apologize to the (then) main tank because I accidentaly stole aggro, as I get set into a routine so easily.
Paladins have many abilities that make them perfect as support tanks, backup healers, or even a primary healer if a group lacks one. The diversity of the EQ2 Paladin is part of the appeal of playing the class. I think playing a one dimensional character would be so boring.
As a Backup Tank, Paladins get an increasing number of buff spells, like Grant of Armament that increase main tanks Mitigation and Avoidance. Paladins also have a high cost, but effective group heal, as well as a direct heal and wards. It's rare that I play in a full group and as the back up tank, but I can say without a doubt, those were some of the best groups I've ever played in and we literally mowed through yellow ^^^ heroic enemies faster than they could pop.
The game is not over and Paladins are not dead. Keep playing your characters and I'm confident that things will begin to grow on you. That being said, here is some recommendations to optimize your Paladin's effectiveness:
1). Concentrate on upgrading armor and weapons over spells. As you level up, constantly check the market for the best weapons and armor that you can afford.
2). Beginning with your most important spells/abilities, upgrade them to AdeptI. Check the broker frequently for good deals on spells.
3). Power is most imporant for a Paladin. As long as we have power, we can ward/heal/attack. As soon as we run out, we usually die. Buy some potions on the market and put them in your toolbar, use them in a pinch.
Also, if you are duoing or soloing, buy and use the most powerful 2 handed weapon you can use. At level 20, that will commonly be a Pristine Imbued Steel or Carbonite Great Sword. This is more important than ever, because in LU13 they changed the mobs so that they consume power more slowly. Killing an enemy quickly is more important than ever, especially if they can heal themselves. I experienced this problem last night in Maelstrom Vault against a Blue ^^^ Heroic Ice Storm.
If after playing your Paladin for a couple of more weeks and you still aren't happy with him/her anymore, then it would probably be best to create a new character and class and "rediscover" the game. Level 19 is a sizeable investment of time, but you will level your second character so much faster. Good luck with whatever decision you make.
Paladin Xczaria
Neriak Server
Company of Free Qeynosians
Not everyone agrees with any of the changes that have been made since EQ2 went live, especially those people who the changes affect most. I'm still digesting LU13 and the changes to our class, but I always approach a change/update/modification with the mindset that at the very least SOE developers think it is the best decision for the game as a whole.
Some of the changes are things that I have thought about before and am surprised to find that the developers were apparently thinking the same thing. For example, while I enjoyed special class abilities ever 10 levels or so, that were special versions of regular spells/abilities (I especially loved the 2 handed attack that healed me), I wondered why they just didn't let us pick a spell and have it be Master II quality.
I like the idea of stances very much and find that it adds a nice bit of flavor to the strategy department. Depending on what I'm fighting and wether or not I am soloing or in a group, I will adjust my stance accordingly.
While making the encounters tougher created a knee-jerk reaction, in most people, of disfavor (heck, even I get perturbed at being smacked around by a level 23 ^^^ Griffon add, where as I use to take on 3 at once), I think it is also for the better. I believe the challenging fights will create a more rewarding experience, especially when we eventually achieve victory. When people first played Shinobi ( an extremely difficult 8 bit era game) most didn't give up, they just tried harder.
As far as tanking goes, I have long believed that Paladins make great tanks, but make the best support tanks and that hasn't changed since LU13. In almost every group I have been in, I have usually ended up being the main tank. It is so rare that I don't main tank, that when the exception occurs, I have to apologize to the (then) main tank because I accidentaly stole aggro, as I get set into a routine so easily.
Paladins have many abilities that make them perfect as support tanks, backup healers, or even a primary healer if a group lacks one. The diversity of the EQ2 Paladin is part of the appeal of playing the class. I think playing a one dimensional character would be so boring.
As a Backup Tank, Paladins get an increasing number of buff spells, like Grant of Armament that increase main tanks Mitigation and Avoidance. Paladins also have a high cost, but effective group heal, as well as a direct heal and wards. It's rare that I play in a full group and as the back up tank, but I can say without a doubt, those were some of the best groups I've ever played in and we literally mowed through yellow ^^^ heroic enemies faster than they could pop.
The game is not over and Paladins are not dead. Keep playing your characters and I'm confident that things will begin to grow on you. That being said, here is some recommendations to optimize your Paladin's effectiveness:
1). Concentrate on upgrading armor and weapons over spells. As you level up, constantly check the market for the best weapons and armor that you can afford.
2). Beginning with your most important spells/abilities, upgrade them to AdeptI. Check the broker frequently for good deals on spells.
3). Power is most imporant for a Paladin. As long as we have power, we can ward/heal/attack. As soon as we run out, we usually die. Buy some potions on the market and put them in your toolbar, use them in a pinch.
Also, if you are duoing or soloing, buy and use the most powerful 2 handed weapon you can use. At level 20, that will commonly be a Pristine Imbued Steel or Carbonite Great Sword. This is more important than ever, because in LU13 they changed the mobs so that they consume power more slowly. Killing an enemy quickly is more important than ever, especially if they can heal themselves. I experienced this problem last night in Maelstrom Vault against a Blue ^^^ Heroic Ice Storm.
If after playing your Paladin for a couple of more weeks and you still aren't happy with him/her anymore, then it would probably be best to create a new character and class and "rediscover" the game. Level 19 is a sizeable investment of time, but you will level your second character so much faster. Good luck with whatever decision you make.
Paladin Xczaria
Neriak Server
Company of Free Qeynosians
Let me say right out front that I don't play a pally or any tank class for that matter. However, my experience with both priest & scout classes post LU#13 is that SOE did not nerf so much as modify and mold.
Their stated intent all along was to bring classes and sub classes closer in to their initial intent for each classes' skill set.
I find that post LU#13, both my ranger and my warden are better prepared to do the jobs they were created for. My warden heals just as well as before... differently but just as well. And my ranger is even more effecient now at doing the slice and dice.
Neither is any less survivable now in a solo or small group situation. In fact, the ranger tends to take less damage than before while dishing out even more. While my warden is still really good at healing over time and even better at dishing out damage.
The one variable that must now be considered is the selection of mobs as targets. SOE was deadly serious when they told us that heroic mobs were now gonna be ... heroic! While soloing post LU#13, I have accidently engaged group mobs twice with my ranger. Both encounters ended badly.
I do not take this as a sign that SOE has nerfed my ranger, but rather as an indication that I need to be more careful in conning a mob before I begin tossing arrows at it!
Once again, I cannot speak to how SOE has changed the pally class but I would hazard a guess that you will be no less able to compete than you were before. You might have to re-learn a few tricks but in all probablility, the tricks are there to be learned.
I am sure that there are those who feel that SOE has ruined the game by changing the way things work. I don't. I think they did a brave thing by jumping in and modifying the combat system now instead of waiting another 4 years till things were really messed up! But, maybe I'm just a "glass half full" kind of guy.
Edited, Sun Oct 2 17:48:37 2005 by OldBlueDragon
Their stated intent all along was to bring classes and sub classes closer in to their initial intent for each classes' skill set.
I find that post LU#13, both my ranger and my warden are better prepared to do the jobs they were created for. My warden heals just as well as before... differently but just as well. And my ranger is even more effecient now at doing the slice and dice.
Neither is any less survivable now in a solo or small group situation. In fact, the ranger tends to take less damage than before while dishing out even more. While my warden is still really good at healing over time and even better at dishing out damage.
The one variable that must now be considered is the selection of mobs as targets. SOE was deadly serious when they told us that heroic mobs were now gonna be ... heroic! While soloing post LU#13, I have accidently engaged group mobs twice with my ranger. Both encounters ended badly.
I do not take this as a sign that SOE has nerfed my ranger, but rather as an indication that I need to be more careful in conning a mob before I begin tossing arrows at it!
Once again, I cannot speak to how SOE has changed the pally class but I would hazard a guess that you will be no less able to compete than you were before. You might have to re-learn a few tricks but in all probablility, the tricks are there to be learned.
I am sure that there are those who feel that SOE has ruined the game by changing the way things work. I don't. I think they did a brave thing by jumping in and modifying the combat system now instead of waiting another 4 years till things were really messed up! But, maybe I'm just a "glass half full" kind of guy.
Edited, Sun Oct 2 17:48:37 2005 by OldBlueDragon
I curently paly a lvl 31 paladin (played since luanch) and over all the paladin has been improved in somany ways since launch. you will find for self been taking as main tank over eny other class but gaurdian and somtimes shadow knight. Bezerker and monk classes tend not te tank at since they take alot and cant stand up to it. as for raiding, iv only gone on 2 raids and in both its like eq1 you will in most times be the off-tank, but with all theese new abilitys being off tank is much more effective then to be main tank in a raid. i mostly solo and do guild stuff, as pick up groups tend to be dieing alot in zek right now on my server.
In all honasty you will play the class and then decided if you want to keep it or reroll. i would just play and see. as for as end game goes paladins are very highly saught after for raids as we keep the MT alive untill the templar can heal him back to life. we allso keep the healers safe from them selfs since the tend to draw agro.
In all honasty you will play the class and then decided if you want to keep it or reroll. i would just play and see. as for as end game goes paladins are very highly saught after for raids as we keep the MT alive untill the templar can heal him back to life. we allso keep the healers safe from them selfs since the tend to draw agro.
I am a new player to EQ2 and as such I asked a lot of questions. I came in post 13 upgrade. I was a level 14 shaman last night and was taking on 3 linked level 15 mobs that were triple down arrows. Definitely pay attention to what you are fighting. Took on a group of level 13 mobs, that were 4 linked but again triple to double down arrow. Soloing I had no problem. However, I saw 1 heroic mob that was level 13. Took my entire power bar to take down 1 mob.
Not very effcient.
Not very effcient.
Quote:
Also, if you are duoing or soloing, buy and use the most powerful 2 handed weapon you can use. At level 20, that will commonly be a Pristine Imbued Steel or Carbonite Great Sword. This is more important than ever, because in LU13 they changed the mobs so that they consume power more slowly.
Thanks for the encouraging words concerning the paladin class. I love playing the class so much and your insight means more to me than words can express. I do have a question concerning one of your comments. I've been told (whether correctly or incorrectly) that unlike EQ1 to stick with 1HS and get yourself a good tower shield post 20. The remark stated that there is no damage bonus (unlike EQ1) for 2HS, hence your damage output and mitigation is better with 1HS and the shield. Is this correct.
[sorry if this should be more along the lines of the paladin/fighter forum]
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