I love to group, but I love to solo, too. Some days I'm just not "on" enough to be responsible for the welfare of others. Especially bad if I choose to play a cleric.
Anyways, I'm not sure that the game's been around long enough for people to really have an understanding of the mechanics and higher classes. It also sounds like everyone's having a good time soloing, which is sure to change at the higher levels.
For soloing, I've always liked cleric-type classes, for their high AC, moderate weapon ability, and buffs/heals; I've also always liked summoners, for the built-in tank, they're like a mini-party of your own. In EQ(1), I expected the cleric to be more soloable, but was sorely mistaken. The necro I played later was *much* more soloable. Of course, neither compared with a druid. Are druids still *the* solo class? Is there another class that will be the most soloable?
While people haven't gotten into third-tier classes yet, I imagine that those who really think through their games have already put together the mechanics well enough to make a good guess as to what later levels will be like.
I haven't had the chance to play EQ2 at all, or even watch it played, although I have been lurking in the forums. Am I missing a clearly soloable class (till later levels)? For all I know, it's monks. Or hell, the difference between paper and practice could reveal anything -- it could be shadowknights for all I know (do they get a pet)?
I'm looking right now at eventually going to either a dark elf necro or dwarven templar, but I'm open to anything. I want to be valuable to a group, but almost anyone is, really. So I really want to be able to travel and quest alone when I feel like it.
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Soloability: cleric vs. summonerFollow
Oh yes, and, just as importantly: the fun factor. :p
How much fun are people having in either class (cleric/summoner)? Are there any regrets or complaints? Help me make my decision; sway me. ;D
How much fun are people having in either class (cleric/summoner)? Are there any regrets or complaints? Help me make my decision; sway me. ;D
I play a Summoner (currently 18) and have a good friend that plays a Cleric (currently 20th).
My Summoner solos very well >IF< the mob I pull is well-separated from others, is solo and my pet can hold aggro for at least 2/3 the fight. I can and do regularly take down yellows if all three of those criteria are met. SoE seems to have established the con of mobs by having higher con mobs dole out exponentially more damage than their lower-con brethren. A blue might tag me for 20 (my damage is higher) while a yellow tags me for 90 (far higher than what I can do). If my pet is taking those hits, I'm OK; if it's me taking those hits, I'm running.
I've found that a Summoner is basically neither fish (DPS caster) nor fowl (excellent pet). My nukes are grossly inferior to those of, say, a Sorceror (I'd guess I nuke for about half of what the pure DPS casters do). My pet isn't nearly as good as that of a Magician or a Necromancer in EQ1 (that might change at 20th when I become a Necromancer). However, the pet does give me a bit more survivability than a non-pet caster and I think I have more versatility than a true DPS caster does in terms of group-friendly buffs).
My friend's Cleric is far more capable of standing toe to toe with mobs than I am. At 20, he gets to wear heavy armor which helps out even more. His damage spells are on a par with, if not slightly better than, mine...plus he can heal and buff himself. He tells me that he CAN solo, though he rarely has to, as invites come from the moment he logs into the game (far different from my experience- almost no one invites Summoners unless just about all other options are exhausted).
SoE has really tried to make all classes more group-friendly than they were in EQ1 and, to an extent, they've succeeded. That said, true tanks and healers of any type are still going to be in far greater demand than any other class type because, especially in EQ2, those are MANDATORY classes to have in a good group.
My Summoner solos very well >IF< the mob I pull is well-separated from others, is solo and my pet can hold aggro for at least 2/3 the fight. I can and do regularly take down yellows if all three of those criteria are met. SoE seems to have established the con of mobs by having higher con mobs dole out exponentially more damage than their lower-con brethren. A blue might tag me for 20 (my damage is higher) while a yellow tags me for 90 (far higher than what I can do). If my pet is taking those hits, I'm OK; if it's me taking those hits, I'm running.
I've found that a Summoner is basically neither fish (DPS caster) nor fowl (excellent pet). My nukes are grossly inferior to those of, say, a Sorceror (I'd guess I nuke for about half of what the pure DPS casters do). My pet isn't nearly as good as that of a Magician or a Necromancer in EQ1 (that might change at 20th when I become a Necromancer). However, the pet does give me a bit more survivability than a non-pet caster and I think I have more versatility than a true DPS caster does in terms of group-friendly buffs).
My friend's Cleric is far more capable of standing toe to toe with mobs than I am. At 20, he gets to wear heavy armor which helps out even more. His damage spells are on a par with, if not slightly better than, mine...plus he can heal and buff himself. He tells me that he CAN solo, though he rarely has to, as invites come from the moment he logs into the game (far different from my experience- almost no one invites Summoners unless just about all other options are exhausted).
SoE has really tried to make all classes more group-friendly than they were in EQ1 and, to an extent, they've succeeded. That said, true tanks and healers of any type are still going to be in far greater demand than any other class type because, especially in EQ2, those are MANDATORY classes to have in a good group.
i will have to agree with you...my summoner still sits at level 11 as she just doesn't solo very well. the capability is there, but its like walking on pins and needles approaching a mob to solo for fear that one little event can turn the tide of the fight to failure. seems once the pet loses agro, there is no getting it back...and then you better hope root gets off before the 3 hits it takes to kill you land.
my cleric on the other hand has NO PROBLEMS soloing. I can stand up in front of a mob and whack away at it while keeping an indirect heal up (slow but extremely efective) or stand there and land HO after HO burning the mob down quickly (along with my power pool). I've found that a healthy dose of both tactics makes life wonderful for a cleric.
and yes, I too am often sent group invitation after invitation.
my cleric on the other hand has NO PROBLEMS soloing. I can stand up in front of a mob and whack away at it while keeping an indirect heal up (slow but extremely efective) or stand there and land HO after HO burning the mob down quickly (along with my power pool). I've found that a healthy dose of both tactics makes life wonderful for a cleric.
and yes, I too am often sent group invitation after invitation.
Hey, that's a much better response than I expected, thanks :) It's good to get a reply from someone who has (first or secondhand) experience with both classes. It sounds like I might prefer cleric. I do like to be loved :) And I love running around healing and buffing newbs. Do spells still work like EQ1? That is, do they get more powerful the more you use them?
The only thing I hate about clerics is the stress. If everyone dies, it's always the cleric's fault. And you certainly can't ever look away from the monitor. But if this game really is soloable, then I can take a few days off and run around on my own.
Still, I probably won't know much until templars/inquisitors and necros/elems start running around.
The only thing I hate about clerics is the stress. If everyone dies, it's always the cleric's fault. And you certainly can't ever look away from the monitor. But if this game really is soloable, then I can take a few days off and run around on my own.
Still, I probably won't know much until templars/inquisitors and necros/elems start running around.
In EQ2, I box a Necro and a Shammy (both lvl 24) and he's what I can tell you. Your Necro gets good DoT's, and decent DD spells. Self buffs and pet buffs are decent too (pet heal, agitation, etc). The pet's level goes up with your leveling, which is a bonus. As in EQ1, you get different types of pets, I believe an even greater variety. First the scarab/spider pet (not sure of class), then the skelly warlock, and my most recent is a Fighter class. The Warlock (lvl 20 spell) is good as long as someone else is holding aggro. The Spider is decent at all things, and the Undead Minion (lvl 24), a fighter class, is definitely the best for tanking. At 20-something you also get a cool little spell, Swarm of Rats, that summons two little rats that gnaw away at a single target, though they only last until that mob is dead.
At 24, I can easily solo with the App2 Undead Minion (even the Mobs, which now in my 20's, I'm finding hit unusually hard (sometimes for 150-200). You cannot, however, effectively kill say 3 - 4 mobs simultaneously solo.
Clerics look to be a pretty sick class too, however. I'll have to defer to a cleric on this...but they always have the best heals/hp buffs, but with MOBs that con blue hitting for 15-20% of your 1100 HP's at lvl 24, a buff equal to one hit doesn't seem to cut it very well.
Shammy(Defiler) is a nice class because they get the Ward line of spells = Rune from EQ1. They also get very nice DOTs and significant slows and debuffs. I can ward myself, pull with slow, or now my slow DOT combo, and then launch chain HO's with HO (DOT DD), DD, HO (DOT DD), DD...cycle, rinse, repeat....They do not get a pet, nor have I seen regen, or a decent heal spell, so dunno about higher up...btw, if you don’t do HO’s you’re missing about 50% additional production at least, not to mention the mana you’ve just saved….
Syph - Mistmooregets good DoT's, and decent DD spells. Self buffs and pet buffs are decent too (pet heal, agitation, etc). The pet's level goes up with your leveling, which is a bonus. As in EQ1, you get different types of pets, I believe an even greater variety. First the scarab/spider pet (not sure of class), then the skelly warlock, and my most recent is a Fighter class. The Warlock (lvl 20 spell) is good as long as someone else is holding aggro. The Spider is decent at all things, and the Undead Minion (lvl 24), a fighter class, is definitely the best for tanking. At 20-something you also get a cool little spell, Swarm of Rats, that summons two little rats that gnaw away at a single target, though they only last until that mob is dead.
At 24, I can easily solo with the App2 Undead Minion (even the Mobs, which now in my 20's, I'm finding hit unusually hard (sometimes for 150-200). You cannot, however, effectively kill say 3 - 4 mobs simultaneously solo.
Clerics look to be a pretty sick class too, however. I'll have to defer to a cleric on this...but they always have the best heals/hp buffs, but with MOBs that con blue hitting for 15-20% of your 1100 HP's at lvl 24, a buff equal to one hit doesn't seem to cut it very well.
Shammy(Defiler) is a nice class because they get the Ward line of spells = Rune from EQ1. They also get very nice DOTs and significant slows and debuffs. I can ward myself, pull with slow, or now my slow DOT combo, and then launch chain HO's with HO (DOT DD), DD, HO (DOT DD), DD...cycle, rinse, repeat....They do not get a pet, nor have I seen regen, or a decent heal spell, so dunno about higher up...
Syph - Mistmoore
At 24, I can easily solo with the App2 Undead Minion (even the Mobs, which now in my 20's, I'm finding hit unusually hard (sometimes for 150-200). You cannot, however, effectively kill say 3 - 4 mobs simultaneously solo.
Clerics look to be a pretty sick class too, however. I'll have to defer to a cleric on this...but they always have the best heals/hp buffs, but with MOBs that con blue hitting for 15-20% of your 1100 HP's at lvl 24, a buff equal to one hit doesn't seem to cut it very well.
Shammy(Defiler) is a nice class because they get the Ward line of spells = Rune from EQ1. They also get very nice DOTs and significant slows and debuffs. I can ward myself, pull with slow, or now my slow DOT combo, and then launch chain HO's with HO (DOT DD), DD, HO (DOT DD), DD...cycle, rinse, repeat....They do not get a pet, nor have I seen regen, or a decent heal spell, so dunno about higher up...btw, if you don’t do HO’s you’re missing about 50% additional production at least, not to mention the mana you’ve just saved….
Syph - Mistmooregets good DoT's, and decent DD spells. Self buffs and pet buffs are decent too (pet heal, agitation, etc). The pet's level goes up with your leveling, which is a bonus. As in EQ1, you get different types of pets, I believe an even greater variety. First the scarab/spider pet (not sure of class), then the skelly warlock, and my most recent is a Fighter class. The Warlock (lvl 20 spell) is good as long as someone else is holding aggro. The Spider is decent at all things, and the Undead Minion (lvl 24), a fighter class, is definitely the best for tanking. At 20-something you also get a cool little spell, Swarm of Rats, that summons two little rats that gnaw away at a single target, though they only last until that mob is dead.
At 24, I can easily solo with the App2 Undead Minion (even the Mobs, which now in my 20's, I'm finding hit unusually hard (sometimes for 150-200). You cannot, however, effectively kill say 3 - 4 mobs simultaneously solo.
Clerics look to be a pretty sick class too, however. I'll have to defer to a cleric on this...but they always have the best heals/hp buffs, but with MOBs that con blue hitting for 15-20% of your 1100 HP's at lvl 24, a buff equal to one hit doesn't seem to cut it very well.
Shammy(Defiler) is a nice class because they get the Ward line of spells = Rune from EQ1. They also get very nice DOTs and significant slows and debuffs. I can ward myself, pull with slow, or now my slow DOT combo, and then launch chain HO's with HO (DOT DD), DD, HO (DOT DD), DD...cycle, rinse, repeat....They do not get a pet, nor have I seen regen, or a decent heal spell, so dunno about higher up...
Syph - Mistmoore
Quote:
And I love running around healing and buffing newbs. Do spells still work like EQ1? That is, do they get more powerful the more you use them?
thankfully this does not work the same. everyone has to earn their own. no more selling temps in pok and letting n00bs smack their way dumbly to the higher levels.
you can only cast a buff on someone else while they are grouped with you, and once they leave the group that buff poofs off them as well.
cool thing about buffs in eq2 though, they (most anyway) last for 12 hours...no more recasting. and if, say, a cleric joins your group and he already has his group buffs up on himself, they automatically appear on you and the rest of the group. they only have to be re-cast if you die.
Quote:
you can only cast a buff on someone else while they are grouped with you, and once they leave the group that buff poofs off them as well.
I like balancing, and I can see where this came from. But maybe they could have scaled the buff to the level of the recipient as well as the skill of the caster. I always liked helping out newbs -- at least with stuff like SoW or a minor str/ac buff. Nothing game-breaking, but helpful.
How do spells go up in levels, then? Can you recast a buff that's already on you? Can you heal at full HP?
Oh well, I plan on soloing as much as possible, so as long as I can buff myself, that's all that really matters :P
Quote:
At 24, I can easily solo with the App2 Undead Minion (even the Mobs, which now in my 20's, I'm finding hit unusually hard (sometimes for 150-200). You cannot, however, effectively kill say 3 - 4 mobs simultaneously solo.
Well, I certainly don't need to be fighting a whole group at once. It sounds like necros do solo quite well. I may have to actually try both classes out, which kinda sucks considering that I'll have to get to about lvl 30 before I can form any well-informed conclusions.
Maybe when more templars get up in levels, I'll hear how they do soloing toe-to-toe with mobs.
As a lvl 18 Cleric (just took Inquisitor sub quest) I can say I easily solo yellow mobs for solo exp. I can even do orange ones ( I did ...at lvl 15, giant Vulrich's to get to 16, all conned orange to me, few close calls, but basically it wasn't too bad) I can always take out double arrow up green mobs and often double arrow up blues...though I tend to stay away from the DA blues, some are pretty damned tough to do alone and will still smear you all over.
I have never played mage beyond the Isle of Refuge, but I know some people that do. Some seem to have solo down to an art, and can take out yellows pretty good, but I think every mage will tell you they are scared of links and if they run out of their Mana /Energy whatever you want to call it... they're in trouble.
Clerics have a lot of heal and buff spells, and we have certain spells and abilities that actually regen our HP as we get hit. We do have some nice damage spells as well. I find solo'ing as a cleric is fun and not too hard, unless you get yourself in a tight spot (and I've done that a few times :P hehe.)
Still the general rule applies to Clerics too. We don't hit hard for melee damage. Our power comes with our MP, and once that's out... better hope the mob isn't so much tougher than you that you can't slowly wittle it away with some wussy smacks with your hammer or whatever. The best way to be sure you can solo? Know your class, and your spells...and know your limits. Clerics and Mages both should avoid groups of enemies and go for singles. We don't do well when 3+ mobs are smacking on us, as our defense isn't that great and we'll burn through our MP trying to stay alive.
Every class can solo, I had a lvl 14 crusader and I found that yellow mobs killed him pretty easily because of the lack of healing spells... but he took out groups of blues a heck of a lot easier than my Cleric can. It basically just comes down to knowing your abilities and having a good idea of strengths and weakness.
Edited, Wed Dec 1 03:57:51 2004 by Ivven
I have never played mage beyond the Isle of Refuge, but I know some people that do. Some seem to have solo down to an art, and can take out yellows pretty good, but I think every mage will tell you they are scared of links and if they run out of their Mana /Energy whatever you want to call it... they're in trouble.
Clerics have a lot of heal and buff spells, and we have certain spells and abilities that actually regen our HP as we get hit. We do have some nice damage spells as well. I find solo'ing as a cleric is fun and not too hard, unless you get yourself in a tight spot (and I've done that a few times :P hehe.)
Still the general rule applies to Clerics too. We don't hit hard for melee damage. Our power comes with our MP, and once that's out... better hope the mob isn't so much tougher than you that you can't slowly wittle it away with some wussy smacks with your hammer or whatever. The best way to be sure you can solo? Know your class, and your spells...and know your limits. Clerics and Mages both should avoid groups of enemies and go for singles. We don't do well when 3+ mobs are smacking on us, as our defense isn't that great and we'll burn through our MP trying to stay alive.
Every class can solo, I had a lvl 14 crusader and I found that yellow mobs killed him pretty easily because of the lack of healing spells... but he took out groups of blues a heck of a lot easier than my Cleric can. It basically just comes down to knowing your abilities and having a good idea of strengths and weakness.
Edited, Wed Dec 1 03:57:51 2004 by Ivven
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