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Letter From the Producer LVII (Information on Hunts)Follow

#27 Jul 10 2014 at 12:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Hyrist wrote:
Personal Housing, again, that's defiantly server structure delays. The fact that they flat out stated that they're monitoring new wards for Free Company housing because it would effect availability for Personal Housing to expand too quickly was telling.

There is a difference between being "physically impossible" and making a conscious choice to delay a feature. That's really the only issue I had with what you were saying and the conclusion you're trying to draw here. It's not that we disagree(though we may), it's that you've linked two things together which don't really have any relation.

Hyrist wrote:
Personal Housing, again, that's defiantly server structure delays. The fact that they flat out stated that they're monitoring new wards for Free Company housing because it would effect availability for Personal Housing to expand too quickly was telling.

This is kinda another reason this doesn't line up for me. They're monitoring wards. They're monitoring the economy. If you were to ask Yoshida how many players are currently subscribed to XIV, it probably wouldn't take him long to find out. If you were to ask how much gil the average player in XIV has, again; it's an answer you could expect in a relatively short period of time. If they want to maintain server structure stability, they can do that(as they did by implementing the steep cost with FC housing). You shouldn't even have to ask them how much of their population is interested in personal housing. It's been in the works long enough at this point that they could accommodate everyone with an active account for no gil cost at all.

We can speculate all day about their reasons for holding it back, but the logistical side of that equation could have been solved now for quite some time. I'm not saying that the game is dying, but the numbers have been tapering off for quite a while now and Yoshida has admitted that. The fact that they're monitoring all of these things so closely and for so long makes physical probability even less of an excuse.
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#28 Jul 10 2014 at 12:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm not saying that the game is dying, but the numbers have been tapering off for quite a while now and Yoshida has admitted that.


What Yoshi-P has said is that people tend to unsub and resub for patches, which is very normal for the industry. In-game populations seem to reflect this... the game has been absolutely packed over the past couple days, complete with server queues when logging in and more lag than usual when running dungeons. In between patches, the population is still strong. The game has definitely lost its new-car smell, but the 365-day population seems to have settled and that number feels very sizable.

I think the bigger problem is that FCs in the game have become very fractured as that 365 population has settled. Groups banded together and initially bought FC housing, but since then groups have splintered to form new FCs while remnants of original FCs still cling to their housing. So now, in addition to FCs that didn't get housing earlier, there's a second wave of new FCs all in need of housing too... only this time, players have had several more months to save up gil, so the competition for land is much more fierce.

The problem at launch was SE short-changed its server budget; I'm willing to bet they repeated that practice, hence the collision of more housing wards and personal housing infrastructure.

We're all just guessing, but that's my guess.
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#29 Jul 10 2014 at 1:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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Thayos wrote:
I think the bigger problem is that FCs in the game have become very fractured as that 365 population has settled. Groups banded together and initially bought FC housing, but since then groups have splintered to form new FCs while remnants of original FCs still cling to their housing. So now, in addition to FCs that didn't get housing earlier, there's a second wave of new FCs all in need of housing too... only this time, players have had several more months to save up gil, so the competition for land is much more fierce.

That's part of the reason I never understood why they didn't just skip FC housing altogether in favor of personal. It's easier to make an estimate on how many players will want their own personal housing. As I said above, they have access to the number of players logging in regularly as well as access to how much gil these players have on average. Assume that every player will want personal housing, look at the average amount of gil players have now and are earning over a period of time(we've had almost a year now) and then set a price on housing that allows the target number(based on expected server strain) of players to access it immediately as others strive to earn enough to secure their own.

It was a mistake to short-change the server budget the first time. Probably could have been avoided with better planning of beta testing, open beta and the time frame they left themselves prior to launch, but that's easily forgiven. Eventually if you keep repeating the same mistakes though...



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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#30 Jul 10 2014 at 2:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Again, I don't feel like this is a matter of 'repeating the same mistakes' at least not in the case of housing. I do feel like it's still paying for the initial mistake in this regard. It looks like to me like they had a set server expansion budget and they burnt out of it early, and SE Corporate had limited to no approval for expediting more servers.

As far as designing content to be sampled by the entire player-base, I'm on the fence about. I've stated multiple times on every boards that I don't like content that can be monopolized and pushed out of, and, due to the limited Spawn nature of the hunts - this seems to be the case. Kind of sad because the only reward I really want to get out of this is both cosmetic and really far off. The upgrade items have other paths for getting them, which is the primary draw for most people.

And my gaming availability is mostly taken up by Raid Scheduling. So really, it's going to be a long, slow road for me to get anything out of that system. I do hope they change things around a bit there.

That said, I do like the concept of actually hunting in the open world. Just wish it was more accessible and the prices for items adjusted according to their actual value. Not sure why an ilvl 80 weapon is valued double to an upgrade to an ilvl110 piece of armor.
#31 Jul 10 2014 at 4:12 PM Rating: Good
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Hyrist wrote:
Again, I don't feel like this is a matter of 'repeating the same mistakes' at least not in the case of housing. I do feel like it's still paying for the initial mistake in this regard. It looks like to me like they had a set server expansion budget and they burnt out of it early, and SE Corporate had limited to no approval for expediting more servers.


But at what point do you say "Ok, we expected x amount of players but we've exceeded that by y amount. We should probably explain to our customers that we were unprepared, apologize and then do our best to correct the issue"? Keep in mind, we're still talking about a game that had spent the prior 3 years trying to bring the game up to an acceptable level. Not certain what Wada's exact quote was, but it was something along the lines of 'saving the game to restore faith in the franchise'.

When you go from a game no one cares about to setting records for concurrent logins, SE corporate would have no problem lengthening the leash. You're basically telling me that you believe Yoshi couldn't go to corporate and ask for a larger budget touting the same records he was so happy to share with us to get that freedom. I just can't buy it man. I don't think SE is that stupid.

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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#32 Jul 10 2014 at 4:27 PM Rating: Excellent
I've been blasted for saying this before, but corporations aren't charities (nor are they people). Corporations aren't artists. Corporations make money, plain and simple. The top brass at SE almost certainly aren't motivated by the same things as the folks on the XIV development team.

When the game launched with a much larger-than-expected playerbase, SE had to retroactively buy new servers and get them up online. Now, we're seeing a similar thing unfold with housing, only it's unclear whether SE will buy the infrastructure needed for all FCs to have houses.

Just looks like the same thing that happened before. SE is trying to minimize infrastructure costs.

Also -- and I've said this before, too -- but I don't think SE quite understands the motivations of Western gamers. There's really not a lot of difference between hardcore and casual gamers other than time spent in game. Casual Western gamers still tend to want access to everything, and they're willing to go to great lengths to get it... just like how EVERYONE is going to want a personal house, just like EVERYONE wants to upgrade to a Novus, just like EVERYONE wants the best gear, just like EVERYONE wants to kill elite marks, etc.

SE always seems surprised when all gamers want to do EVERYTHING, rather that the things that may simply appeal to them more.
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#33 Jul 10 2014 at 4:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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FilthMcNasty wrote:

When you go from a game no one cares about to setting records for concurrent logins, SE corporate would have no problem lengthening the leash. You're basically telling me that you believe Yoshi couldn't go to corporate and ask for a larger budget touting the same records he was so happy to share with us to get that freedom. I just can't buy it man. I don't think SE is that stupid.



I wish I could share your confidence in that statement. However, there has been a litany of mistakes across the board in their decision making throughout their history.

Not to mention, even if this is possible that they have the budget, FFXI ran on fairly minimal requirements across the board. The matter of having advance server structure could very well be a new concept for the company at large. So stupid may be to strong of a word verses simply inexperienced. Remember, at peak, we've quadrupled FFXI's stable population.

I'm a fan of Square Enix, this much is as clear as day to anyone. They have more loyalty out of me than I've given to any other gaming company. But I don't put it past them to dunce on this one, or have some out-lining circumstance we don't know about that's tying their hands in some way. (Maybe the push for FFXV and KH3 has them strained on redistributing manpower within the company and they're already taxing their outsourcing budget.) Either way, I just strikes me that they haven't stepped up in some manner. The development cycle really does seem rushed and strained.

Edited, Jul 10th 2014 6:34pm by Hyrist
#34 Jul 10 2014 at 4:35 PM Rating: Excellent
This might be a Catwho question, but could SE be hitting some kind of limit with capacity at its data centers, and adding more servers would require a substantial (and disproportionately large) investment?
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#35 Jul 10 2014 at 6:21 PM Rating: Decent
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Hyrist wrote:
The matter of having advance server structure could very well be a new concept for the company at large. So stupid may be to strong of a word verses simply inexperienced. Remember, at peak, we've quadrupled FFXI's stable population.

We're just talking about expanding something that's already in place. I'm sure there is more to it than just plugging a cable into a server and plugging that into the wall, but we're talking about something relatively small scale in comparison to those potential 2 million plus registrants. It's not like they couldn't first implement it as a test. Where are the test servers for XIV anyway?

Hey guys, we're delaying housing but we want to make absolutely sure everything is running smoothly. We're opening new plot servers for testing of features. We encourage everyone to participate so we can work out as many problems as possible before the final implementation. All those who participate will receive a [insert nifty furniture piece here]. Thank you for your time and cooperation and we look forward to seeing how you like personal housing. Yadda yadda...

Why not?

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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#36 Jul 10 2014 at 6:41 PM Rating: Excellent
Thayos wrote:
This might be a Catwho question, but could SE be hitting some kind of limit with capacity at its data centers, and adding more servers would require a substantial (and disproportionately large) investment?


It's not just servers. It's all the other things that go into a datacenter infrastructure. Hell, it could be cooling problems for all we know. Server farms generate a lot of heat.

I've only helped spec out a handful of the REALLY GIANT data centers (one being built in AZ now... god I am so glad I don't do that job any more) but the costs for scaling up past a certain point become exponential. These days, smart companies who have variable server loads go for solutions like AWS where they can rent capacity on demand but that's not feasible for an MMO.

I'm going to view this from a business standpoint. They had a set hardware budget for Fiscal Year 2014, which started in March, and they borrowed against it last fall. The brass at SE probably gave them a nice boost to the budget as a bonus for the game doing so well, but they already burned up that money too. Rather than keep dipping their hands in the cookie jar, SE management told them to plan out their needs better for the FY 2015 budget and just make do with what they have until then.

So that means stretching out the existing hardware until it hits the breaking point.
#37 Jul 11 2014 at 12:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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The hunt marks were clearly not designed to be as popular as they are, and may have to be tuned a bit, depending if the interest continues to be high.

I'll definitely agree they need some tuning on top of pop options, as I said in another thread, but even as popularity wanes some once the new content rush subsides, I'd say it feeds into my since-launch belief the game really needed meaningful open world content. As an aside, even if SE does tweak stuff, I don't think they should call things a day in that respect, either. Right now, the process is basically a plan B toward dungeon gear (which are still subject to primary tome weekly caps). Crafting, FATEs, and a true 50 zone or two are still some things that need love, too.
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#38 Jul 11 2014 at 12:49 PM Rating: Excellent
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Seriha wrote:

I'll definitely agree they need some tuning on top of pop options, as I said in another thread, but even as popularity wanes some once the new content rush subsides, I'd say it feeds into my since-launch belief the game really needed meaningful open world content. As an aside, even if SE does tweak stuff, I don't think they should call things a day in that respect, either. Right now, the process is basically a plan B toward dungeon gear (which are still subject to primary tome weekly caps). Crafting, FATEs, and a true 50 zone or two are still some things that need love, too.



I like that wishlist, I'm of the idea that the zones will likely be expansion content, not something we'll see in patch.

FATEs, I'd like to see more complexity and variety in. Alternative Tome acquisitions are here in spades. You get them hunting, you get them doing PvP, you get them in Dalies (Granted, pittance amount) you get them in Primals, and you get them in Raids and Dungeons. Hunts being the first of what I hope to be multiple open world methods to obtain Tomes.

But the methods of getting Tomes has expanded quite a bit over time. I'm liking this trend.
#39 Jul 16 2014 at 11:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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Seriha wrote:
Quote:
The hunt marks were clearly not designed to be as popular as they are, and may have to be tuned a bit, depending if the interest continues to be high.

I'll definitely agree they need some tuning on top of pop options, as I said in another thread, but even as popularity wanes some once the new content rush subsides, I'd say it feeds into my since-launch belief the game really needed meaningful open world content. As an aside, even if SE does tweak stuff, I don't think they should call things a day in that respect, either. Right now, the process is basically a plan B toward dungeon gear (which are still subject to primary tome weekly caps). Crafting, FATEs, and a true 50 zone or two are still some things that need love, too.


That would be really cool, a dedicated zone where you needed to be at least ilvl 90 to not die, andand another where you needed a party of four ilvl 90 to simply get through the zone.
#40 Jul 16 2014 at 12:34 PM Rating: Excellent
Valkayree wrote:
Seriha wrote:
Quote:
The hunt marks were clearly not designed to be as popular as they are, and may have to be tuned a bit, depending if the interest continues to be high.

I'll definitely agree they need some tuning on top of pop options, as I said in another thread, but even as popularity wanes some once the new content rush subsides, I'd say it feeds into my since-launch belief the game really needed meaningful open world content. As an aside, even if SE does tweak stuff, I don't think they should call things a day in that respect, either. Right now, the process is basically a plan B toward dungeon gear (which are still subject to primary tome weekly caps). Crafting, FATEs, and a true 50 zone or two are still some things that need love, too.


That would be really cool, a dedicated zone where you needed to be at least ilvl 90 to not die, andand another where you needed a party of four ilvl 90 to simply get through the zone.


Nice, this sounds fun. You could incorporate a ton of the existing content types into a lvl80-90 open map area - Maps, FATES, Sidequests, Escorts, Etc. I would even enjoying farming something like Atmas in a challenging zone like that.

I'm guessing we wont see higher lvl mobs like this in an open world area until the expansion/level cap raises. The idea to add them ahead of time based purely on the currently obtainable ilvl's is brilliant. Hell you make an open world area that you can't even traverse at ilvl 90 and it would be awesome. Packed full of lvl 100-110 mobs and having lvl 100 harvesting nodes, fishing holes, random chests. Bring back the excitement of dangerous exploration with a party required.
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