Atma farming...Follow

I still don't get why you are so opposed to RNG systems when this is one of the few RNG systems in the game? The other one is in coil and you don't have to deal with that (admittedly).

If I can put together a PF group to do Twin (this was when we were only getting a 10% echo buff) and succeed, I'm sure you can do the same. FFXIV App has a wonderful Twintracker plugin that makes this fight a no brainer after you've done some of the research.

Leviathan is also extremely easy compared to the past primals. I have had soooooo much success in PF Levi Ex groups compared to 2.1's Titan Ex groups.

Turn 6 can currently be completed with i90 gear and MAYBE an Allagan weapon. I would argue you don't even need the Allagan weapon but...meh. What do I know anyways? You know my FC wrote a guide for Turn 6, right, that can be found here? We discovered the trick a little after other FCs had but they had not publicly posted it.

OK: so you don't have enough time to attempt coil every week or the numbers to do so.

What is gating you from trying Leviathan? It really frustrates me. I would like to be on some of your servers so that I could get you through this content. Just this weekend I did Titan Ex in a PF group (2 shot) and Leviathan Ex farming (5 successful runs out of 7). I would love to put together a turn 5 group for you all as well.

It gets me thinking: perhaps we can set aside a time for us all to queue into DF at once. We can communicate via TS/Mumble/Vent/whatever. Similar to how premade Alterac Valleys happened in WoW.

If you're really serious about it, I will be glad to teach you and get you through the fight.

Before doing so please realize:

-In T5, you will be subjected to RNG
-In Levi, you will be subjected to RNG
-In turn 6, you will be subjected to RNG
-In all current coil turns (outside of T3), you are subjected to RNG

This is a quote from my profile:


6 and a half months without seeing the drop I needed. I had to wait till 2.2 when turn 4 was farmable and even THEN it still took 15 runs.

Did I complain? Maybe a little but never on the forums. Did it bar me from completing anything in the game? No. My FC held server second Twin (first FC broke apart shortly after). All using my myth legs and getting by with what I had. I had to wait 15 weeks to get my Allagan scepter as well. So I was doing this content with my zenith weapon and, then later, the extreme primal staff that is rewarded after completing all three.

This is why I will always ask: why do you need it right this moment? I'm currently in turn 9. My gear is really bad for this turn but somehow we are able to get her to 45% before we wipe. It's a DPS issue in some instances but, for a BLM, my DPS is actually pretty good.

Skill will always, ALWAYS reign supreme. This is why I did Titan HM in mostly Demagogue and ****** gear but managed to stay alive and do the most DPS.

I'm really getting mixed signals. You want progression based on skill and there are several paths that require it. Why shy away from it? Join a PF group and test your skills there. You can be pretty undergeared and still be successful in most things in this game if you know what you're doing. Would I recommend it? No. Point is: skill goes a long way. A shiny animus weapon is nice to have but not necessary to beat these fights!

Let me break it down for you:

Turn 6 - Beatable with i90 gear and weapons
Turn 7 - Beatable with i90 gear + Levi caliber (tidal) weapons
Turn 8 - Beatable with ~i95 gear + Levi caliber (tidal) weapons
Turn 9 - Beatable with ~i98 gear + Tome weapon (with sand)

What I am seeing is people wanting animus weapons when they aren't doing content that really requires them. For old coil, you have the echo buff. For the extreme primals, you have the echo buff.

Gnu brought up a point to me the other day regarding turn 7. He is the only person I have talked to where I would say an animus weapon would be beneficial to getting him through a specific turn. Problem: after you beat turn 7, you have access to the unidentified tome which gives you a weathered weapon. These can be upgraded to i110 after downing T8 which, honestly, isn't that hard compared to T7: it's just a big DPS check.

Perhaps you can just clear up the confusion. If not interested in Levi or Coil, why must you have the animus so soon?

My answer would be: because it's ******* shiny that's why. But those are aesthetics. :P

I used to think like this too, until my friend had me try Skype.

There's.... just something.... about real-time conversation that makes things a LOT easier.

We did a few Heroic Dungeons in WoW (he was new to WoW) and I was sending him /tells before some pulls telling him what to do and he goes "get on skype" and I was like "...why?"

Well, let's just say now we use Skype for EVERYTHING we do in games almost, unless we're just there to do one thing real quick. Not only can you explain crap fast and easy, while you're also doing stuff, you can talk about other stuff too! Oh, and sometimes emergencies happen; you don't have time to type that stuff out.

I used to be "bleck" about VoIP but now I love it. I've tried it, and I see why it is awesome.

RE@Hitome: As I've said before, RNG in dungeons is OK, because a boss always drops something. It might not be the exact thing you're looking for, but that boss will drop something that's usable for somebody and the fight is usually fun and interesting (which is why people do it).

However, when you're doing solo fates... just admit it: You can't even try to compare some Lv5-20 FATE to Twintania, Leviathan, etc in terms of complexity, challenge, and/or how interesting it is to actually do. You feel that sense of "We won! Yay!" when you take these bosses down even if they are not as hard as they used to be. I can't remember the last time I killed 20 squirrels in a Lv5 FATE and go "YAY I WON!"

And.... well, if you don't get the Atma out of a FATE, you get nothing except 20-40 GC seals and 20 gil. At least if I were fighting a boss, something would drop that someone gets to benefit from, maybe even me. It might not be the specific item I need, but maybe it is an item that nobody else needs and I can greed on it and win it for another class. Your example above with the pants... how many times have you done that content and gotten items for other classes? Not the pants, but other items? Sure you're 0/26 or whatever that said (forum system isn't letting me see your post because I actually hit reply on Kojiro's post instead), but surely you got at least a few items out of those runs even if they weren't the pants, right?

EDIT: And I never said I wasn't interested in Levi or Coil -- the weapon is a solo-obtainable weapon, and as such is clearly the "you should get this first". That way when I do enter Levi or Coil with that weapon, I will perform much better than I would without it! That's the way I've always approached games -- I obtain the best stuff I can through solo obtainable means before tackling group content at max level, that way I can perform the best I can before dipping my toes into endgame waters. I see lots of noobs wearing absolute junk in dungeons, and I see how much that sucks, and I don't want to be that guy who walks into a dungeon undergeared.

Edited, Apr 29th 2014 9:02am by Lyrailis

Also, this caught my eye:



If you're going in with a group of friends, then you probably won't have any guys that sound like 12 year old girls and they surely shouldn't be raging.

I wouldn't want to do a PUG with VoIP, no. But groups of friends, sometimes it is fun to just talk about random stuff during slow times. And if you use a good headset (I have a Razer Banshee which works really nice) you can just lower the mic boom and it is almost like they're in the room with you, you don't need no PTT or anything (at least with Skype). And with good headphones, nobody IRL can overhear the conversation (except for my end).

The only use people have for Skype/TS is to call out the monster script if you don't know it yourself or somehow still fail even knowing it and aren't observant. You can easily beat most if not all content in this game without vocal chat.

I think it's the fact the people who hate this/upset with this usually:

1. Ignore that there are ALTERNATIVES YOU CAN GET IF YOU DECIDE YOU WANT TO ACTUALLY TRY TO GET THEM INSTEAD OF BRUSHING THEM OFF.
2. Would rather complain and have SE change stuff than go for said alternatives.
3. Twist someone's words to state they say Relics aren't important despite Yoshida himself stating Relics will never be the best weapons you can obtain in this game and will only be upgraded in order to keep them from being too obsolete every patch.

It's very, very simple. Don't like one path? It upsets you so much? It frustrates you? Go do something else fun...like..oh, I don't know..clearing actual content or fighting a god damn primal which is more fun than sitting around spamming FATEs?

People ask why is it so hard to understand that people hate this and want something other than this RNG FATE grind? Well, why is it so hard to understand SE gave you multiple paths and sometimes said alternates actually being better? 15% coil buff makes Turn 5 childs play unless you simply can't clear content due to your own skill or none of your friends/FC/LS who cleared it wants to help you.

Know what that's called? A player problem, not a design issue. You're guaranteed Loot in Leviathan and Coil, but not always 100% what you wanted, but depending on loot rules, you will come out with more loot over time than you would farming Atmas if you still can't get them at this point.

So basically you yourself are saying that grinding FATEs sucks and is boring compared to average endgame material.

Games should be fun, not boring. How is that hard to understand?



So basically, you're saying "Well, if you think 1 path sucks, you should just forget about it. Let's not FIX that path to make it better, and more appealing, let's just forget it even exists".

*rolls eyes*

Right, let's NOT improve the game, let's NOT make the game more fun, let's NOT fix something that very few people seem to like just because options do exist (that not everybody can do). That's awesome game design philosophy, innit?

And don't even pull the "You wanted it handed to you" card. Don't even try that. We've stated NUMEROUS times that we DON'T want it handed to us, we want it to be somehow Interesting, and not "Play the Lottery". Progression-based. Not "You might get it in 5 times or 500 times". We're willing to put due work in to get it, but grinding out low level FATEs is just boring no matter who you are, whether you're the Fresh 50 barely able to start the quest, or the veteran endgamer who's cleared most of the content.

It could be. I guess I could always start one too. After the amount of time I've put into not clearing the fight I kinda just don't care right now.

Funny enough what put on my little mini-break starting Sunday morning was the WAR in CB HM. He had defiance up and my WHM had more HP than he did... I tried running high level roulette three times in a row and there he was every time. He couldn't keep hate, and we were down a DPS by the first boss two times in a row. The third time the queue popped and there he was, I just turned around and left. Haven't logged on since. Maybe that's childish of me, but it's kinda how I'm feeling about the game right now.

I think we may be feeling the same way.

Maybe it's a matter of perspective and expectations. I don't know. But I'm pretty disappointed with what I'm able to accomplish when I log in right now. The way it looks to me today, here are my options:

Level another class/job...which will only wind up getting me to where I am now.
Die infinite number of times to content I know I could clear if I could find 7 other people competent enough to clear it with me.
Farm myth tomes for books to level up a weapon useful for content I currently have no hope of experiencing.
Craft/Gather to make stuff that's completely useless.

It just feels a lot like banging my head against a wall with no hope I'll make a crack in it. I'm open to suggestions lol

Agree 100 percent.

Too much of the difficulty in this game is limited to dodging, and fights where one or two mistakes result in certain death are just frustrating. They also don't really require much strategy.

This probably won't come until the expansion, but I really hope we eventually see content where fights are determined not by reacting to mob AoE, but by decisions made by players in the heat of the moment. Back in FFXI, some of my favorite fights were the ones that dragged on for nearly half an hour while we improvised our way to victory. The battles in XIV are so scripted so far, that it's really difficult to achieve that same degree of satisfaction.

Like, there's literally just one strategy for beating Titan... one strategy for Ifrit... one strategy for Garuda... etc. It shouldn't be that way. Different party setups should provide you with different tools to clear out content in unique ways. Otherwise, there's not really a whole lot of purpose in leveling various jobs.

I don't sound like a 12 year old teenage girl. :(

I agree about typing but it has been made clear to me that people actually need me to hold their hands in raids over TS.

All my T5 PF groups never require a voice chat program. I assume you are 1) running TwinTracker and 2) know the fight well enough/can pay attention to my divebomb macro.

I actually don't like using chat programs since I focus the best when I am streaming music in the background/not listening to other people panic.



Not after:

1) Everyone in the group has the item and it drops to the floor
and
2) You've been doing that fight for 25 weeks

Just as boring as grinding anything else at that point. The one point you do have, though, is that having unusable abilities during FATEs isn't fun. Why couldn't they just scale potencies based on FATE level and allow you to have access to all your abilities (GW2)? I'm guessing because 1) people will still find something broken (like AoEing down stuff when some jobs don't have strong AoE), 2) unfair advantages to high level players compared to new players, and 3) lazy design.

Why are other drops relevant to me? I can only really main one job in current stuff like the second coil due to gated designs. It's very frustrating to have another job at 50 ready to go into coil in case, oh, a WHM or SCH has to leave early or wants a change of pace only to realize, due to gating, my gear isn't up to snuff so I'm stuck on one job the entire patch.

Gating has issues as well which are more threatening to people with multiple jobs leveled and those of us who have more free time on our hands. RNG remedies this.

A perfect system? No. But will we ever come to a consensus on a perfect system? Some of us think WoW's current system is nice but others have pointed out flaws in it. And, it relies on RNG as well just as it always has but also has gated content in the form of dailies and currencies like 14.




There seems to be a quote by a poster that was deleted but I'll respond anyways: I'm not mad that people like or dislike this addition to 14. What I am irritated by is ignoring other progression paths, the desire to obtain the animus ASAP without any logical reason, and obtuse responses.

Maybe you all think I am in love with the Zodiark system but I am still on book 1, you know? The staff looks awesome but even that isn't enough motivation to do FATEs, grind a dungeon I dislike, and do other mind numbing tasks. I simply avoid doing what I don't like.

Both Hitome and Hito Yu could use another job at 50 but that isn't happening either until I see some changes to leveling (probably won't happen). I feel like I have enough to do right now between school and second turn progression. Most of my crafting friends are continually busy gathering and crafting new stuff at the moment so I know there is plenty to do in that area.

Maybe you are right: maybe people who want an extra challenge but can't do raiding deserve some more content in that area.

Two things:

1) Extreme primals were the answer to this and were received poorly
2) This was my complaint 4 months ago (lack of content/rehashing things) and wasn't really popular on these forums because apparently there were so many other things to do

This is probably what irks me the most.




Anyways, like I said: the offer still stands. We could all queue into DF at the same time and hope to end up in the same group. Only thing that would be required is a voice chat to set up the initial matchmaking.

Might be fun to have a ZAM get together day for those of us on different servers.

Edited, Apr 30th 2014 8:34pm by HitomeOfBismarck

I'd definitely like to take you up on that offer, though I wish we had some sort of cross-server manual friendlist/grouping thing like WoW has but who knows maybe someday, lol.

But at any rate, when I get up to that point I'll let you know: been having to deal with RL stuff lately so my climb to 50 is a bit slower than it should be. Some days I barely have enough time to do about half of the GC Craft recipes each day (some of them I end up buying out of the market if they're cheap enough).

But once the remodeling of the gaming room gets done hopefully I'll have some more time and I can get myself up to that content. The reason I've been kinda "eh" over the RNG nature of Atmas, is when I do finally get there, I don't want to be 2-3+ patches behind and be caught in an endless catch-up quagmire.

So hopefully they tweak it or something by the time I do get there.

Let's set it up!

Would you be willing to take lead on this? Let's make new thread setting date/time (Friday night? Late-ish? 9:00pm CNT?) and asking for people who are interested. Between you and I, we can find some voice chat server that everyone has access to. Skype probably the easiest for this. Still invite people without access to voice chat, although that will be more difficult to initially setup in DF.

Is Leviathan in DF? I don't think so yet. Maybe test this out on something simple like T1-T2 farming. The problem I've had trying to pull this off is that if one person goes to the wrong group in DF, they can't leave right away because of lock-out timer.

Even if this only partially works it would still be cool. What say you?