What are they going to do after Underfoot? From all I have read and heard about the expansion it is very tough and merc's are basically worthless there. Is this true?
I wonder if this is the last expansion. I know I didn't buy it because my 3 box setup doesn't even have a plate wearer in it, and I doubt my pet could tank it.
So for me it looks like the end of the line. Unless I make a tank and get him the proper gear (T5 gear?), AC augs and AA's (minimum 1k?) to tank. I am not going thru all that again.
So has Sony given up on the casual player?
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End of the line for EQ?Follow
Scholar
43 posts
I don't have UF, but some well geared mages report that they can solo in UF after getting the latest pet AAs.
To take a step back, there have always been both hard core expansions and more casual-friendly expansions, e.g. PoP was quite hard when it first came out, with most zones locked behind raids and regular mobs hitting for (then) unheard-of numbers. Discord was another tough (some said "ridiculously hard") expansion when it came out. On the other hand, Ykesha was solo-friendly and LDON/DON were "casual group friendly". Most expansions at least made an effort to strike a balance between soloists, groupers and raiders, but some succeeded better than others, e.g. LDON raids were seriously messed up.
SOD was widely seen as too easy and too boxing-friendly, so UF was made much harder (except for the boomerang game), but it doesn't necessarily mean that the next expansion will be inaccessible to soloists if there is popular demand for it.
On the other hand, with a dwindling subscriber base, if UF is not a commercial success and the number of players continues to decline, we may reach a tipping point where new expansions (or at least full blown expansions) no longer make financial sense. We'd need to have SOE's internal numbers to make a guess, of course, and that's not likely to happen.
Finally, there are other ways to add new content to the game, e.g. that Station Cash experiment that SOE tried a few months ago. I am not exactly a fan of that approach, but that's beside the point.
To take a step back, there have always been both hard core expansions and more casual-friendly expansions, e.g. PoP was quite hard when it first came out, with most zones locked behind raids and regular mobs hitting for (then) unheard-of numbers. Discord was another tough (some said "ridiculously hard") expansion when it came out. On the other hand, Ykesha was solo-friendly and LDON/DON were "casual group friendly". Most expansions at least made an effort to strike a balance between soloists, groupers and raiders, but some succeeded better than others, e.g. LDON raids were seriously messed up.
SOD was widely seen as too easy and too boxing-friendly, so UF was made much harder (except for the boomerang game), but it doesn't necessarily mean that the next expansion will be inaccessible to soloists if there is popular demand for it.
On the other hand, with a dwindling subscriber base, if UF is not a commercial success and the number of players continues to decline, we may reach a tipping point where new expansions (or at least full blown expansions) no longer make financial sense. We'd need to have SOE's internal numbers to make a guess, of course, and that's not likely to happen.
Finally, there are other ways to add new content to the game, e.g. that Station Cash experiment that SOE tried a few months ago. I am not exactly a fan of that approach, but that's beside the point.
IMO, Everquest will still be around for a while. Everyone cried that they were going to nerf the fungi and it NEVER happened. Hopefully they will expand on all the dead ends and endless horizons in game and add a new zone once every two months or so. That would keep peoples interest and might expand population. but I will not go there...lol
Come visit my housing creations 20+ in Cedar Country Meadows, ZEK.
Scholar
29 posts
Read most of the post that come though and hardly ever feel the need to throw my 2 cp in but I am going to throw them in now.
So you think EQ is going to go the way of the DooDoo because you might have trouble with your three box team? It is the end of the line unless you make a tank and gear and lvl it up? Why not make a friend or two and, I dont know, make a group?
The Devs made UF to promote grouping with other players. Honest I have tried it and it works. Mercs, while a great tool to get some (again SOME) things done on your own, were never ment to replace real players. Multi boxing, to me is just puzzling. Oh I understand that with a box team you dont have to put up with noobs or share any loot, but if I wanted to play like that I would re install Bauldurs Gate and save 15 bucks a month.
But hey, its your account (s) box all you want. Ignore other people who might have that tank you need for UF. Quit for all I care, I shall continue to run with my one account and enjoy playing the game with other people.
Noshadow Cast
So you think EQ is going to go the way of the DooDoo because you might have trouble with your three box team? It is the end of the line unless you make a tank and gear and lvl it up? Why not make a friend or two and, I dont know, make a group?
The Devs made UF to promote grouping with other players. Honest I have tried it and it works. Mercs, while a great tool to get some (again SOME) things done on your own, were never ment to replace real players. Multi boxing, to me is just puzzling. Oh I understand that with a box team you dont have to put up with noobs or share any loot, but if I wanted to play like that I would re install Bauldurs Gate and save 15 bucks a month.
But hey, its your account (s) box all you want. Ignore other people who might have that tank you need for UF. Quit for all I care, I shall continue to run with my one account and enjoy playing the game with other people.
Noshadow Cast
Quote:
Read most of the post that come though and hardly ever feel the need to throw my 2 cp in but I am going to throw them in now.
So you think EQ is going to go the way of the DooDoo because you might have trouble with your three box team? It is the end of the line unless you make a tank and gear and lvl it up? Why not make a friend or two and, I dont know, make a group?
The Devs made UF to promote grouping with other players. Honest I have tried it and it works. Mercs, while a great tool to get some (again SOME) things done on your own, were never ment to replace real players. Multi boxing, to me is just puzzling. Oh I understand that with a box team you dont have to put up with noobs or share any loot, but if I wanted to play like that I would re install Bauldurs Gate and save 15 bucks a month.
But hey, its your account (s) box all you want. Ignore other people who might have that tank you need for UF. Quit for all I care, I shall continue to run with my one account and enjoy playing the game with other people.
Noshadow Cast
So you think EQ is going to go the way of the DooDoo because you might have trouble with your three box team? It is the end of the line unless you make a tank and gear and lvl it up? Why not make a friend or two and, I dont know, make a group?
The Devs made UF to promote grouping with other players. Honest I have tried it and it works. Mercs, while a great tool to get some (again SOME) things done on your own, were never ment to replace real players. Multi boxing, to me is just puzzling. Oh I understand that with a box team you dont have to put up with noobs or share any loot, but if I wanted to play like that I would re install Bauldurs Gate and save 15 bucks a month.
But hey, its your account (s) box all you want. Ignore other people who might have that tank you need for UF. Quit for all I care, I shall continue to run with my one account and enjoy playing the game with other people.
Noshadow Cast
Back to LFG? I will pass on that one for the reasons that mercs were introduced in the first place.
Edited, Jan 24th 2010 7:56am by Boomsticker
If Everquest survived GoD and the release of WoW that saw around 60% of the player base leave, then it will survive Underfoot.
No, you wont be able to solo very much in Underfoot. You will have to join a guild and group a lot. Some of the content is very hard, but that doesnt mean there isnt plenty to do outside UF. If you are having so much difficulty in UF then you likely havent exausted the previous content and doing so would increase your enjoyment of UF.
You dont have to be a raider to have a good time in todays EQ. Hang in there, farm some aas, gear up, and you should have a better time.
Ps. What kind of levels/gear/aa does your 3 box have?
No, you wont be able to solo very much in Underfoot. You will have to join a guild and group a lot. Some of the content is very hard, but that doesnt mean there isnt plenty to do outside UF. If you are having so much difficulty in UF then you likely havent exausted the previous content and doing so would increase your enjoyment of UF.
You dont have to be a raider to have a good time in todays EQ. Hang in there, farm some aas, gear up, and you should have a better time.
Ps. What kind of levels/gear/aa does your 3 box have?
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Quote:
If Everquest survived GoD and the release of WoW that saw around 60% of the player base leave, then it will survive Underfoot.
No, you wont be able to solo very much in Underfoot. You will have to join a guild and group a lot. Some of the content is very hard, but that doesnt mean there isnt plenty to do outside UF. If you are having so much difficulty in UF then you likely havent exausted the previous content and doing so would increase your enjoyment of UF.
You dont have to be a raider to have a good time in todays EQ. Hang in there, farm some aas, gear up, and you should have a better time.
Ps. What kind of levels/gear/aa does your 3 box have?
No, you wont be able to solo very much in Underfoot. You will have to join a guild and group a lot. Some of the content is very hard, but that doesnt mean there isnt plenty to do outside UF. If you are having so much difficulty in UF then you likely havent exausted the previous content and doing so would increase your enjoyment of UF.
You dont have to be a raider to have a good time in todays EQ. Hang in there, farm some aas, gear up, and you should have a better time.
Ps. What kind of levels/gear/aa does your 3 box have?
85 mage 1100 AA's
83 ranger 600 AA's (roughly)
83 wizzy 300AA's (roughly)
I am working on tier 4 and the only thing really holding me up is I can't seem to pull those Shocktroopers out of that cluster of mobs on the Disrupt the Siege mission. I can log my monk on in place of my ranger but then the ranger won't get the credit for progression. Once the ranger hits 85 I can get harmony arrow and then I will move on. I have almost all medial essences for the armor.
The thing is as I look to the future I think my whole setup isn't going to be suitable for boxing UF from the sound of it. Even now with all pet defensive AA's and 3 tier 4 healers, some nameds ( the 7k hitters at this point) I have to kick in as a healer. So my pet's tanking days are numbered. I know this.
I only asked the question in the first place because of how much it is going to change the way I play after so many weeks and months getting my box setup to where it is now. In short, UF has done away with all the flexibility of the last expansions. While I am sure that works for some it certainly is not going to work for me and I can't be alone out there.
So here are my options:
A: I pick one toon, buy UF and go on the LFG list.
B: I spend an unknown amount of time to bring up a tank, get his progression, AC augs and 1k AA's.
C: I quit all three accounts and find a different game to play.
None are really appealing options.
Edited, Jan 24th 2010 10:30am by Boomsticker
Scholar
29 posts
I do not ask this to be a jackass, but do you not have any friends in game? I play on the test server and we have one of the lowest populations around, and yes sometimes forming up a group is pita, but once set its awesome. Do you just want to play solo with boxes? If thats the case I can not help you. Do you read gen chat? If so then load up your box set and kill stuff that you already can while searching Gen chat for people who are lfging and make some groups. PUGs can be ugly, but they can be great too. Thats the only thing I can say man, its a mmo there are real people out there, many in the same boat you are.
45 posts
I personally don't think it be the end of EverQuest but rather the close demise of SOE should they refuse to listen to all of it's customers more carefully, this is especially true since the first EverQuest game is currently a cash cow.
But if by some chance if EverQuest no longer becomes a cash cow then that alone can spell trouble for SOE (since SOE is only a Subsidiary of Sony) and Sony itself as a parent company will bail them out but not without a major price to pay.
And that major price to pay will most likely involve a whole new management and as for "So has Sony given up on the casual players?" I personally believe they need to listen to it's customers more carefully or otherwise EverQuest will not become a cash cow anymore.
EverQuest itself cant really die because it alone has already became a very well known culture game and the franchise alone can be bought out just like any other franchise if ever needed most especially if Sony lets it's subsidiary SOE to actually go bankrupt.
But if by some chance if EverQuest no longer becomes a cash cow then that alone can spell trouble for SOE (since SOE is only a Subsidiary of Sony) and Sony itself as a parent company will bail them out but not without a major price to pay.
And that major price to pay will most likely involve a whole new management and as for "So has Sony given up on the casual players?" I personally believe they need to listen to it's customers more carefully or otherwise EverQuest will not become a cash cow anymore.
EverQuest itself cant really die because it alone has already became a very well known culture game and the franchise alone can be bought out just like any other franchise if ever needed most especially if Sony lets it's subsidiary SOE to actually go bankrupt.
Scholar
43 posts
Quote:
The thing is as I look to the future I think my whole setup isn't going to be suitable for boxing UF from the sound of it. Even now with all pet defensive AA's and 3 tier 4 healers, some nameds ( the 7k hitters at this point) I have to kick in as a healer. So my pet's tanking days are numbered. I know this.
If my understanding (based on second hand information) is correct, UF makes boxing difficult not only because you need a well geared tank, but also because in most places you need:
1. crowd control because of high mod density
2. high DPS because of the fast respawn and very high mob HP
3. fast player response due to unusual mob abilities, which can be hard when boxing
So even if you had a well geared and well-AA'd tank, you may still find it hard to box in UF.
Having said that, 3 T4 healer mercs have quite a bit of healing power between them, so I wonder what your pet focus may be. Do you have the one from OMM? It's probably the best one that a casual player without UF can get.
Everquest Next is in development.
Johhn Smedley, Sony Online Entertainment's CEO said so and it is supposed to be something that EQ and EQ II fans will be pleased about.
Rumors are that it will either incorporate both games into one or allow you to take your characters over to the new game.
Johhn Smedley, Sony Online Entertainment's CEO said so and it is supposed to be something that EQ and EQ II fans will be pleased about.
Rumors are that it will either incorporate both games into one or allow you to take your characters over to the new game.
After 16 years, I'm not listing every friggin character.
Quote:
What are they going to do after Underfoot? From all I have read and heard about the expansion it is very tough and merc's are basically worthless there. Is this true?
What do they do after Underfoot? Make a new expansion with a level cap increase, new lands, new quests, some kind of new addition to the game mechanics. Same as every other expansion. Just because Underfoot is hard, doesn't mean there's no where else to go. GoD was hard too. . . .
There's currently no upgrade to mercs for UFT to make them more powerful. So while they aren't totally worthless, their desirability does decrease, especially when you move up into higher tier zones.
Is this the last expansion? That question has been asked since Kunark came out. Rumors of EQs death have been greatly exaggerated. They'll keep making expansions as long as they are profitable.
Has Sony give up on the casual player? SoD was extremely casual friendly. Just because UFT is hard, doesn't mean they've give up on casuals.
Quote:
I do not ask this to be a jackass, but do you not have any friends in game? I play on the test server and we have one of the lowest populations around, and yes sometimes forming up a group is pita, but once set its awesome. Do you just want to play solo with boxes? If thats the case I can not help you. Do you read gen chat? If so then load up your box set and kill stuff that you already can while searching Gen chat for people who are lfging and make some groups. PUGs can be ugly, but they can be great too. Thats the only thing I can say man, its a mmo there are real people out there, many in the same boat you are.
I don't know anyone who bought UF. Of course I will admit I pretty much keep to myself these days but that's because of other problems that have occured over the years which is everyone I knew, well, left the game.
Quote:
Having said that, 3 T4 healer mercs have quite a bit of healing power between them, so I wonder what your pet focus may be. Do you have the one from OMM? It's probably the best one that a casual player without UF can get.
I am using the tier 4 focus you buy from Zeb.
Quote:
What do they do after Underfoot? Make a new expansion with a level cap increase, new lands, new quests, some kind of new addition to the game mechanics. Same as every other expansion. Just because Underfoot is hard, doesn't mean there's no where else to go. GoD was hard too. . . .
There's currently no upgrade to mercs for UFT to make them more powerful. So while they aren't totally worthless, their desirability does decrease, especially when you move up into higher tier zones.
Is this the last expansion? That question has been asked since Kunark came out. Rumors of EQs death have been greatly exaggerated. They'll keep making expansions as long as they are profitable.
Has Sony give up on the casual player? SoD was extremely casual friendly. Just because UFT is hard, doesn't mean they've give up on casuals.
There's currently no upgrade to mercs for UFT to make them more powerful. So while they aren't totally worthless, their desirability does decrease, especially when you move up into higher tier zones.
Is this the last expansion? That question has been asked since Kunark came out. Rumors of EQs death have been greatly exaggerated. They'll keep making expansions as long as they are profitable.
Has Sony give up on the casual player? SoD was extremely casual friendly. Just because UFT is hard, doesn't mean they've give up on casuals.
You may be right. I hope you are right.
Quote:
Has Sony give up on the casual player? SoD was extremely casual friendly. Just because UFT is hard, doesn't mean they've give up on casuals.
SoD was casual friendly.
SoF was casual friendly.
TBS was casual friendly.
TSS was casual friendly.
PoR is don't think was friendly to anyone.
DoDh was casual friendly.
DoN was casual friendly.
OoW was raider friendly.
GoD was raider friendly.
LDoN was casual friendly.
LoY was casual friendly.
PoP was raider friendly.
Luclin was both.
Velious was both.
Kunark was casual friendly.
Given that track record, I am okay with UF being raider friendly and grouper hard.
Quote:
OoW was raider friendly.
PoP was raider friendly.
I would argue that OoW and PoP were both very good group expansions. OoW had great camps in MPG, RSS and WoS.
PoP was a fantastic group expansion, once they removed the raid restriction to progress. BoT, HoH even Nightmare, where I used to solo those stupid frogs. Sure it was a great raid expasnion as well, but it had a ton of group stuff.
I doubt very much it is the end of the line for EQ. UF may have been created to appeal to returnees and players who like the intense scenerio of UF and those players may have been left out for a while?. I bought the expansion. Have them all, need to explore them for sure.
I came back, stopped for a bit and now will quietly get involved more and I lucked out and found a great guild on my home base Povar called Aude Sapere. I will be doing a lot of soloing in the next weeks to get up to 'snuff' and hopefully group with guildies and others once I am not tripping over my shoelaces. I am a very casual player. I play to explore, quest and have fun. So much to learn and get caught up on.
Others are coming back all the time. EQ is one of those games you return to and sometimes is not your major game. I doubt that FFXIV will be a giant hit to the EQ population. For Wow I think FFXIV will take a good percentage of the Wow player base for a while if not for good and all the time, EQ goes on.
So don't worry, scenerios shift with each new expansion and with patches inbetween.
As long as I don't have to go and fight frogs down in the swamp, I will have fun.
I came back, stopped for a bit and now will quietly get involved more and I lucked out and found a great guild on my home base Povar called Aude Sapere. I will be doing a lot of soloing in the next weeks to get up to 'snuff' and hopefully group with guildies and others once I am not tripping over my shoelaces. I am a very casual player. I play to explore, quest and have fun. So much to learn and get caught up on.
Others are coming back all the time. EQ is one of those games you return to and sometimes is not your major game. I doubt that FFXIV will be a giant hit to the EQ population. For Wow I think FFXIV will take a good percentage of the Wow player base for a while if not for good and all the time, EQ goes on.
So don't worry, scenerios shift with each new expansion and with patches inbetween.
As long as I don't have to go and fight frogs down in the swamp, I will have fun.
Boxing isnt just for loot whores or social rejects. Its for folks with small window play times. Whilst the lfg tool was a stroke of genius, it doesnt solve the problem. UF is a challenge for the boxers too ya know. It has the danger of pushing folks who never used to use scripts,macros etc into that category of "exploiters/cheaters". With the new stuff coming out it makes playing with normal players not even a contest, and I agree this in itself is a reason not to play anymore so personally, I dont want to see that happen.
Just thought I'd add the fact that true boxers- who dont do it for financial gain, are probably more loyal to EQ than most especially if they havnt cheated along the way. These boxers WILL build up a tank just to box in UF. Sony knows this, but they are not the folks Sony is trying to disquade from this type of play. In fact I think its the opposite. I think sony wanted to inject a bit of leetness into the game for tanks, which I think was perfect timing.
Just thought I'd add the fact that true boxers- who dont do it for financial gain, are probably more loyal to EQ than most especially if they havnt cheated along the way. These boxers WILL build up a tank just to box in UF. Sony knows this, but they are not the folks Sony is trying to disquade from this type of play. In fact I think its the opposite. I think sony wanted to inject a bit of leetness into the game for tanks, which I think was perfect timing.
As was said by a earlier poster, I rarely respond to threads here. But, I do tend to read most.
To some degree I can relate to the OP, but not completely. My wife and I both 2 box while using 2 Cleric Mercs. Granted that I play a warrior and a Wizzy, and she plays a Cleric and a Chanter, so we have a very balance set-up. We have had very litlle difficulty in UF - primarily just early on in geting use to the mobs. They do react a little differently as did the ones in SoD - and they definitely have more HP's and hit a lot harder. It is not a zone for anyone under 85 in my opinion at this time. But then there are two more sections of the expansion if I remember correctly.
But that can be duplicated if you would choose to maybe join a guild and find someone in that guild that that you can relate to. Also in a family,or causual type of guild the progression tasks that you are unable to handle the guild will usually come through and help you. Also - on the ones that you can not handle, quite often you can be added to the task after some of the higher levels have completed all but the last talk and get credit for it and move on to the next step in progression. That is what our guild has done since SoD came out.
Edited, Feb 10th 2010 9:30am by EagleFlight
To some degree I can relate to the OP, but not completely. My wife and I both 2 box while using 2 Cleric Mercs. Granted that I play a warrior and a Wizzy, and she plays a Cleric and a Chanter, so we have a very balance set-up. We have had very litlle difficulty in UF - primarily just early on in geting use to the mobs. They do react a little differently as did the ones in SoD - and they definitely have more HP's and hit a lot harder. It is not a zone for anyone under 85 in my opinion at this time. But then there are two more sections of the expansion if I remember correctly.
But that can be duplicated if you would choose to maybe join a guild and find someone in that guild that that you can relate to. Also in a family,or causual type of guild the progression tasks that you are unable to handle the guild will usually come through and help you. Also - on the ones that you can not handle, quite often you can be added to the task after some of the higher levels have completed all but the last talk and get credit for it and move on to the next step in progression. That is what our guild has done since SoD came out.
Edited, Feb 10th 2010 9:30am by EagleFlight
WOLF! WOLF! THE WOLF IS COMING!
They had an log in poll asking people what they'd like to see in the future.
Some of the options were (in order of how they popped into my head, not how they were in the list or how people voted, which hasn't been released yet):
New character models
Bags bigger than 10 slots
Player housing
Guild housing (bigger and customizable, not like the GH we have now.)
There were others that I can't remember off the top of my head. But it shows that they are looking into things they could add for the future (next expansion and perhaps beyond.) And maybe give the players something they desire as well.
Not yet, not for a longtime I would think(hope)...
But, in the last year the game has definatedly taken a turn for the worst population wise.
On Bristlebane, the population has dropped roughly 33%. General chat numbers have been reduced from 300+ names on avg to 200.
The two longtime(10yr+) top guilds on the server have suffered... one disbanded and the other, has for the 1st time ever, been reduced to recuiting on guild boards.
But, in the last year the game has definatedly taken a turn for the worst population wise.
On Bristlebane, the population has dropped roughly 33%. General chat numbers have been reduced from 300+ names on avg to 200.
The two longtime(10yr+) top guilds on the server have suffered... one disbanded and the other, has for the 1st time ever, been reduced to recuiting on guild boards.
One word "Marketing"
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