AA bonus?Follow

I thought the bonus to AA xp for those who had fewer AA's was supposed to go live 2 patches ago (I haven't read anything on it in quite some time). I haven't noticed any extra AAxp (and I only have 20 so i would imagine i would be included). is there any news on this?

From what I heard, the bonus was only noticeable up until around 100 aas, then the bonus decayed until 200, where it stopped.

...At this rate, I'll be up over 100 aas before the patch goes Live...

IIRC they were at one point shooting for 1000aa's as the drop off. I dont know if that has changed.

Aye, just saying that's what I heard from reading one of the class forums (I think it was beastlord? Not sure).

The AA changes are currently not on test server.

When they were on test there seemed to be an issue with the scaling.. IE my shaman bot who had at that time around 20ish AA would get about 8 aa in a LOD ... as would someone with over 1k+ aa ..

After about 5 days or so of this they patched test and live with the anniversary stuff and have not put the aa change back on test just yet.

Seems I wasn't too far off with the 1000 or the shape of the curve (yeah, unabashed back patting..) 750 is currently the point at which you return to normal exp.


Follow the link in the previous post to read all about it and see some nice graphs.

Let experience be your guide here.Anything the top level players ***** about usualy gets the axe.Even if they do it I dont think it will be anywhere near 1k AA's.This just isnt their style.

It has always been the rule that the first 300 AA's go into defence for tanking types.Being this change SEEMS to be aimed at tanking types,my guess is 300 AA's will be the limit.

Edited, Apr 1st 2008 10:17am by Boomsticker

No other class will benefit more than tanks from an AA boost.Thats what I ment by SEEMS to be aimed at tanks.Other classes will gain a boost in power by AA's but lets face it,does anyone really care if a wizzy has 100 AA's or 1000 or none at all?They are there for dps and as long as they are casting any damage type spells all is good.Would anyone care how many AA's a shammy has?No.As long as he is slowing the mob he's doing his job.Even a cleric can get by with no AA's if you have a decent tank.But having a tank with no AA's makes the group work so much harder.Having the tank fold like a cheap suit in the first 10 seconds of the fight is almost certain death of the group.

In the end who knows what their thinking is.I just think some of these estimates are way to high.300 is probably to high.They wont give you 1k easy AA's or even 500.Eight years of playing tells me they will give you 50 or 100 and tell you to bow down and kiss their feet because they gave you anything.Cuz THAT'S the way they roll!

Well.... If a wizard has zero and another wizard has 1000 AA you will see a noticable difference in DPS.

What I would most likely notice is that one wizard might actually be a much better team player than the other. Knowing and understanding your toon is the key to survival in risky locations with risky mobs. The wizard class is the only one I have never played, so I dont know the ins and outs of it, but I have seen both good and poor wizard players. (poor being on the side of mostly AFK except for a couple nukes at the end of a fight)

I would agree with you that a 1000 AA tank is likely to be superior to a zero AA tank. But thats not always the case. LEVEL makes a far Far greater difference in tank-ability than does number of AA's. If that person with 1000AA is only lvl 55 right now and the one with zero AA is lvl 80, then that lvl 80 tank is vastly superior. Plus Gear makes more of a (survivability) difference with tanking that it does with casters. Casters can often survive just fine and contribute just fine with very poor gear. Again, with casters, their level is the deciding factor. Higher spells and more utility spells are available to higher levels. Those better spells are immensely better than a lower level spell boosted by some 30% AA modifier had that caster remained at a lower level to earn AA's and not advance to a higher level.

Its very similar to my 71 Monk alt that I created recently. She has zero AA's and just does DPS. She pounds the heck out of stuff though. Its fun to sit back and toggle to her screen and see her kick the snot out of mobs. She doesnt need any AA's to do her job as being one of my DPS alts. She just needs levels and gear to do well, (and the discs that come automatically with levels).

The AA bonus that this change is aimed at is PLAYERS. They want to give players something to help them stay and not feel disillusioned at never being able to catch up to the 'big boys'. So its not so much aimed at tanks or melee or casters or priests or whatever ppl like to think of themselves as, but its aimed it players to retain players.

I am just speaking of a decision on what you want to do with your character. In the comparison I was trying to compare time spent on leveling vrs time spent on AA's.

Its not a true comparison to say lvl 70 with 1000 aa vrs lvl 80 with zero because it takes far more time spent than 10 levels to make 1000aa. It would be more accurate to say lvl 70 with 1000 aa vrs lvl 80 with 800 aa, and then make your comparison between the two characters. (Gear and player skill being the same) It would be really really weird to see a lvl 70 player with 1000 aa, because that would tell me that he really enjoys playing his toon. If that were the case then he would be lvl 80 by now anyway.

Plus, practically everything is level restricted now. All kinds of gear is flat out unavailable to lower levels. (bazaar) Elegant and sublime cultural is 75/79 and even exalted symbols are 70/74. The Bazu and LB augs that power up the cultural are not restricted by level but you wont see many raids any more that are comprised only of mid 60's lvl players hitting up the mobs that drop these. Yes there is a lot of lvl 65 gear out with the SOF expansion that will help a lot of ppl, and is very easy to get, but I bet the players sitting at lvl 55 until they earn 'enough' AA are not going to be too impressed with the current itemization.

If your 67 mage earns 200 AA's before making lvl 68 then that means to me that you would rather have a lvl 67 mage with 'vital' aa's than an lvl 80 mage. 200 aa at lvl 67 is probably somewhat close to the amount of time spent it would have taken to get to lvl 80 instead of sitting at lvl 67.

I also have a lvl 76 mage as an alt I have played since lvl 1. I would say that your DPS difference at lvl 67 with 'vital' aa's isnt what I would call staggering. If you were now at lvl 80 with lvl 80 pet choices and lvl 80 spells it really would be 'staggering' more DPS than you were at 67 with zero AA's. There are a ton of more gear choices available to you at lvl 80 with a ton of foci that you just flat out dont have available at lvl 67.
But, thats just a choice you made for your mage to spend your time at whatever level you want and enjoy whatever zone/content you want.

The guyz on the Combine server didnt have 'vital' aa's to beat Kunark and Velious expansions at lvl 60. The first raiders that entered BOT zone back in the early POP days before the 62-rule, probably didnt solo the mobs there too well either. So what you consider 'vital' is different for everyone. We all get to choose for ourselves what our goals are and where we want to be. Often that is determined for us by our choice of friends and choice of activities. If our friends are all higher level then they will help us get to a higher lvl also. If our activities are leaning toward raiding then a higher level with be INSISTED on. Why? because you contribute more to a team when you are a higher level vrs staying at a lower level and spending that same play time working on AA's.

That is Sony's goal here with the change to help ppl with a choice. The AA change here is for players to have the option to get some AA's that they feel are necessary in order to progress without spending too much time at a level that they dont feel is helping them progress.

I personally believe that the "levels < AAs" argument isn't valid. Mainly because it's a misstatement of the issue at hand.

Certainly a higher level character will be more powerful then a lower level one. But that only matters if both are tackling the exact same content. Since everything in EQ is relative-level dependent, this is an irrelevant argument. At any level, a character with AAs will always be more powerful then one without them. I think that's inherently obvious. A level 55 with 200 AAs, will be more powerful then a level 55 with 0 AAs. A level 80 with 1000 AAs, will be more powerful then a level 80 with 500 AAs. Everything else being equal of course.


Since your ability to advance is entirely based on your capabilities in relation to mobs near your level, this is an important fact to be aware of. Sure, that level 80 with 0 AAs, will be much more capable of taking out level 65 mobs then a level 70 with 300 AAs (to present a more realistic example). However, he wont gain much for doing so, while the level 70 will gain significant exp from that same mob. I would actually argue that the AA gap becomes more significant as you gain levels, especially for tank classes. A level 60 with 0 AAs will be much less hindered by that fact then a level 70 with 0AAs, and him less then a level 80 with 0 AAs. This is because as content levels have increased, the NPCs in those level ranges were balanced with an assumed "average" number of AAs gained at that point. Thus, content gets harder as you advance if you don't get AAs along the way. From about level 60 onward, you'll find yourself with a diminishing capability against similarly leveled mobs if you don't gain AAs. Again, this is most applicable to melee/tank classes, and assumes "all else is equal".


That does bring us to one final point though. Itemization. There are itemization aspects that change this formula. As noted, a lot of tier1 SoF tradeables become available at level 65. Clearly, it makes a lot of sense to get to that point at a minimum before stopping to get any significant amounts of AA points, simply because the relative gains from that gear will outweigh those AAs. However, it's questionable as to the benefit of moving much farther without any AAs, especially as a tank. That jump wont be repeated until you hit level 75 (when some viewable purchaseable armor appears), and at that point, a lack of AAs may still mean more then the extras from the gear. It's a judgement call IMO, but is relevant. Certainly, a level 75 tank in warped steel with 500AA points, is going to be vastly more desired for group content in SoF then one who just leveled up, has 0AAs, and intends to continue on to 80 before stopping.


Obviously, this all assumes you're actually playing the character up through the levels. If you're boxing, or PLing, or are in a guild and getting help leveling up an alt Tank (for example), this doesn't really apply. But if you expect to actually play and advance a character up, you'll really want to stop and get AAs along the way IMO...

Edited, Apr 2nd 2008 6:07pm by gbaji

AA are vastly more important to a tank then anyone else. A tank with 0 AA at level 70 will have a hard time getting reinvites. One with 300 will be somewhat in demand. Ability comes in somewhat but with equal ablitity and level 70 a tank with the defensives will just be better.

Yes a caster with 1k AA vs a caster with 0 AA will have a disparity but it will not be as vast again as a 70 tank with 300 AA vs one with 0 AA (assuming they bought the right AA of course)

Yes of course gear is a factor a tank with 20k hps 4k ac and 300 AA can do fine as a 80 tank on basically all group content. A tank with with 10k hps and 2k ac at level 80 will be miserable for what a tank is intended to do.

But if we restrict the conversation to AA 300ish ( I could be sold on 500 but 750 or 1000 seems high as hell) AA is what is crucial the rest ability and gear. 750 is absurd and will lead to people who dont know how to play getting in over their heads in a similar manner as monster missions created. Really lets leave some sense of acheivement in the game.

I also agree that 750 AA as the mid point for the removal of the bonus seems a bit high. 300 sounds more resonable to me. This should be plenty so that any player/class would feel welcome in any group at their level, whatever level they decided to stop advancing and work on earning 'enough' AA to feel useful.

Quote: "Since your ability to advance is entirely based on your capabilities in relation to mobs near your level, this is an important fact to be aware of."
Bah, its not even 'closely' related, much less 'entirely' related. It is only 'sort-of' related. Just last week a group of 6 of us, all lvl 80, decided to burn a lesson for the fun of it and so we went to Ruins of Illsalin. We blasted and mowed and pillaged and burned ALL LIGHT BLUES, and got 7-8 aa in the 30 min timer. These mobs were nowhere near our level 80. Many ppl choose to hit this zone at the level of 70 and thats cool also. You just wont be mowing them down like we did if you guyz are all lvl 70.

Your ability to advance in levels is ONLY based on your desire to advance and your ability to gather a group of friends who also want to advance, who also have some time to spend advancing.

"Relative-level dependant" means to me: At what level do you feel relatively able to dependably handle the mobs on the quests you are working on or towards.
Do ppl get their 1.0/1.5 epics at a 'lower' level? Yep. Saw that before. Is it easier to do your 1.5/2.0 epic steps if you stop leveling at 67 to earn 200 AA or easier if you were to get to lvl 80 first and then do the epic steps? NOPE. In fact you must be at least lvl 69 to get your 2.0 epic because you must enter RSS as a requirement to enter Anguish.
Is it easier to work on the Buried Sea Jonas Hand aug quest at lvl 67 or 80? Is it easier to lay waste to waves of mobs that you are farming for tradeskill items at 67 or 80?
Is it easier to get that AC30 aug from Ashengate if you are lvl 67 or 80? What about that nice AC aug in Buried Sea, or those nice augs in Thallassius?
How about that tasty WIS: +10 INT: +10 MANA: +90 SV COLD: +15 SV MAGIC: +15
Mana Regeneration: +3 (Soloable/Kite-able) aug from Rockstorm in Jewel Atiiki? It's a 60/65 aug so you can wear it at 67, but he is a lvl75 mob and would it be easier to kill him and to kill all the PH's around him if you are lvl 67 or 80? I regularly kited Rockstorm at lvl 75 when that was the max limit, but Kiting him now would be way simpler and faster and I could kill many more PH's to spawn him faster now.

SO level dependant is your own personal cushion of safety. Not what level of mob you are facing since the level of these mobs and all these quests are already set and dont change based on your level. This was true back in the LDON era but its not true now. Doing these quests do become somewhat easier if you get a bunch of AA's, but they become much much easier and much much faster and much much simpler if you spend your time earning levels instead of racking up hundreds of aa's. With latest-expansion gear and latest-expansion spells and latest-expansion levels, all this stuff becomes do-able and "I am working on xxx quest today" instead of "someday I hope/plan to get xxx".
Your gear almost naturally upgrades as you advance in level. It is practically impossible albeit Highly Highly unlikely that you will advance in levels and not acquire advanced gear. It is almost practically normal for you to stagnate, as to gear upgrades, if you sit at a certain spot killing the same mob for hundreds of AA's

If you make the personal decision to stop advancing and work on some AA's, then that is fine. Perfectly fine. Have some fun and waste some mobs and set up a campfire in Riwii or BOT while you are at it to take advantage of the hot zone bonus's. Just dont count yourself out of the most recent expansion because you dont think you will ever see it due to you being a 'lower' level than that expansion requires. If your play time is 'less' than others around you, then just focus your efforts into what you find as fun. As long as you are progressing you are doing fine, and are less likely to feel 'dead in the water' and not advancing, killing the same boring mobs in the same camp spot over and over and over.

Quote: "Certainly, a level 75 tank in warped steel with 500AA points, is going to be vastly more desired for group content in SoF then one who just leveled up, has 0AAs, and intends to continue on to 80 before stopping"

My comment is well, if that guy who is playing that lvl 75 tank had made the decision to be lvl 80 instead of stopping advancing at lvl 75 to earn hundreds more AA, then RIGHT NOW, he would have about 300 AA and be wearing "steamcores" in his warped steel armor and be vastly better at tanking the group content that he needs to accomplish whatever quests he is working on. Not too many lvl 75 tanks are going to be able to handle the 'Group Content in SOF', 'Sublime' quest or the 'Eron Jewelry' quest or the 'Face aug' quest, REGUARDLESS of if they have a couple hundred more AA or not.


Edited, Apr 3rd 2008 4:25pm by kirbyramz

True story:
Years ago when Kunark came out I was in a guild with a husband/wife team of SK/Shaman Iksars. They spend hours and hours and days and days camping the Iksar Beserker Club and the guy kept turning down invites to group out in the 'new' Kunark world. He and his wife sat there in the basement of Kurns Tower waiting and waiting for the stupid Jester to show up and also have that club on him.
He kept telling me that he 'HAD' to have that club in order to advance and they he was going to sit there and kill the PH over and over and over until he got it. Day after day, when I logged in and saw him on he was still lvl 20-21 or so and sitting in that basement hunting that stupid jester.

Meanwhile I dinged lvl 40 and was blasting away mobs in 'far-off' lands at the time. I was having a ball of fun in the new expansion and he had barely left the door of Cabilis and was stuck at lvl 20-21, ALL because he felt he couldnt advance without this item.

Both he and his wife quit not only our guild but also EQ and I only saw him on once about 6 months later and then never again. He never got past lvl 20-21 or so.

I equate that same exact mentality with the thought that some ppl have of "I MUST have xxx number of AA in order to advance." I think that mentality is just wrong. It is detrimental because it hurts your game experience, and its bad because it causes you to dislike something that you are presumably are playing for fun in the first place. That is a sure fire way of quitting something due to frustration at a system.

Instead, if your thought is "I am having a lot of fun here with my friends and I am working on AA's for xx reason" then cool. Have fun.

Edited, Apr 3rd 2008 4:45pm by kirbyramz