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Stamina...Im confused...Follow

#1 Jan 21 2004 at 7:02 PM Rating: Default
Could someone tell me wich stats do what, exaclty? I know like dex ups the rate combat and procs go, and str makes you do more damage...but im completly confused about stamina...
#2 Jan 21 2004 at 7:47 PM Rating: Excellent
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STR: Determines the amount of stuff you can carry. Also affects the max potential damage you can do (very minor increase in damage).

STA: Determines your bonus HPs (can be signficant). Also determines the size of your endurance pool (used for combat skills). Used to be used to determine how fast you got tired when running or fighting, but that was removed in favor of the endurance pool system recently.

DEX: Determines your chance of a proc going off. Also has an affect on combat skill increases.

AGI: Minor effect on avoidance AC (very minor!). Also, *may* have an effect on defensive skill increases.

INT: Determines the size of your mana pool (int casters: wizard, necro, chanter, mage, shadowknight, bard?). Also provides a bonus to skill up chances for many skills (including trade skills).

WIS: Determines the size of your mana pool (wis casters: cleric, druid, shaman, ranger, paladin). Also provides a bonus to skill up chances for many skills (including trade skills).

CHA: Determines base prices that merchants will sell to you (adjusted by faction of course). Also has a minor effect on mind affecting spells (charms specifically). The vote is still out last I heard on whether cha affects mezzes or fears though.


Also note that trade skills often have an associated stat that affects skill up chances. Normally, the highest of wis or int will determine skill up chance. However depending on the skill, another skill may also be in effect if it's the highest. Smithing uses str and fletching uses dex for example. I have no idea about others though since I'm not much into tradeskills.


There's probably some other minor stuff, but that's the most important things to know.
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#3 Jan 21 2004 at 8:12 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji

wow - short but to the point!


int and wis is like left and right for me - i always get confused
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#4 Jan 21 2004 at 10:27 PM Rating: Decent
I would just like to add one thing to gbaji's post. It seems that he gives str a very minimal emphasis. However, STR also adds ATK. Based on some parses I have seen (no personal testing yet, I'm lazy) this raise in ATK could have significant value to your DPS. I'm to lazy to link the thread but I can tell you it is on the Paladin boards and also there is a link to it somewhere in the Castersrealm general forums recently.
#5 Jan 21 2004 at 10:49 PM Rating: Good
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The general consensus is that the ATK value gained by adding strength isn't the same as ATK added by other effects.

The problem is that some stats (like atk and ac) are made up of a collection of factors. They aren't compared directly against anything either. The values are just there to give you a general feel for the relative "amount" of something that you have.

In the case of AC, there are two major components involved, and they are applied separately. Avoidance affects your chance of being hit, and mitigation affects where in the range of damage you could have taken any particular his is more likely to fall (basically how much damage you take per hit on average). What affect gaining a point of AC has is extremely hard to determine because you may not know how much of each type you have, and different amounts of each type will work better or worse depending on the stats of the mob you are fighting.

ATK is also split and in a very similar way to AC. There's your "chance to hit", and "damage per hit". High values of the first help you overcome avoidance AC. High values of the second type help you overcome mitigation (with the "remainder" determining how much damage you actually do)

Pay attention to your atk value. It will change when you use weapons with different skills. It will *also* change when you equip multiple weapons (check values when dual wielding versus using a single weapon for example). Finally, it'll change when you add str.

Clearly, weilding two weapons doesn't actually increase your chance to hit with each swing. Clearly also, it doesn't increase your damage per hit. However, it does increase the total number of swings you'll get out of that weapon combo. While there's going to be a correlation between that gained atk value and DPS, it says nothing about how you compare against the opponent you're fighting. A 15th level warrior may have the same atk value when using DW as a 20th level paladin. Odds are the 20th level paladin will do more damage against a 20th level mob then the warrior will though (due to level difference if nothing else).

All values that add to atk are not equal. Not even close.

The effect of str on the damage calculation is very well known. I'll list it out if someone really wants to know (It's been awhile, so I'd have to dredge it out of my memory). However, it *only* affects your maximum damage, and then only to a small degree (depending on relative amount of str you're increasing). That's also not going to increase your average much. There's also another modal factor that plays a significant part in damage done at higher levels that almost completely eliminates the average increase to damage based on increasing the max damage value.


The effects have been parsed numerous times. The atk value increase you see when you buff your str is not above and beyond the small increase in damage you'll do over time. It's just a reflection of that increase. You don't hit more often because you increased your str. You just do a tiny bit more damage per hit.
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#6 Jan 22 2004 at 12:22 AM Rating: Default
STA - Affects duration to hold breath underwater.

My 2cp.
#7 Jan 22 2004 at 1:15 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
The general consensus is that the ATK value gained by adding strength isn't the same as ATK added by other effects.


This apparently is out of date.

In a recent thread I asked about ATK and was pointed at some analyses done recently which show ATK from STR being the same as raw ATK.


Also CHA is used to check Aggro on resist with the lull line of spells. With the increase in use of this spell line in LDoN this becomes more useful to know. The "minor effect" it has on charms is on the duration - not that minor if you are charming.
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#8 Jan 22 2004 at 1:50 AM Rating: Good
Yes, this seems to be something to do with the recent patches.

I have some old logs from Iluien that I intend to compare when I have some time.

Under the "old" system, increasing strength increased the chance to hit for maximum or near maximum damage and increased the actual maximum damage slightly.

If you looked at a histogram of hit dmage, increased strength would show a cluster of outlying hits around the maximum for the weapon/skill.

Gbaji is right in that with a normal dual wield combo the effect on average DPS was minimal, even unnoticeable.

But with a very high damage weapon, say Windblade, increasing strength did make a noticeable difference.

Is it possible to attach a graph/picture to these posts?

PS Cobra, how do you insert those links?

Edited, Thu Jan 22 01:50:53 2004 by Iluien

Edited, Thu Jan 22 01:55:04 2004 by Iluien
#9 Jan 22 2004 at 2:06 AM Rating: Decent
Gbaji you need to check out the recent analysis done by Coprolith over at the beastlord boards. All the parses are showing that the attack gained from strength is equal to pure attack. It also shows that there is a linear relationship between inceasing attack and increasing dps. This reltionship does deviate from a linear quality once you reach the higher attack values due to the effect of hitting the level of attack that can produce the max hit for a weapon. If you are interested in the research it is here http://www.beastlords.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=211
#10 Jan 22 2004 at 9:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Personally I am in the "CHA is good" camp of enchanters and fully believe it has a significant effect on resists. Of course I, like anyone in either camp say, you will just have to take my word on it.

*Editorial*
I swear SoE come out and said CHA has a effect on charm and mezz resist checks. Since Charm they re-resist every tick that is how it can extend your duration. EVERY time Charm breaks, it breaks on the spell tick - the exact same time as root or mezz will wear off.

They also stated that CHA hasNO effect on fear and that the effect it has on necro mezzes is MUCH less than it has on Enchanter mezzes. Wish I could find that release.
#11 Jan 22 2004 at 9:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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Charisma also affects the likelihood of Divine Intervention going off. DI is a cleric spell cast on tanks and others vulnerable to taking large amounts of damage, as it has a *chance* of going off when the tank's health is below 20 percent and restoring him to full health.

In this scenario it's the tank's charisma that matters, not the cleric's.
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#12 Jan 22 2004 at 10:05 AM Rating: Decent
Couple missed points

Dex: Adds to archery and melee to-hit ability and increases chance of successful channeling (casting a spells when getting pummeled on). Also increases chance of firing off a weapon item effect (procs).

INT and WIS - Affects skill gain rate equally. Whichever stat is higher on your character will be used for non-melee skill gain chances. A Shaman with 255 wis and 80 int will skill up just as fast as a Wizzy with 255 int and 80 wis. Think about it, it has to be this way. If either Int or Wis has an advantage in this area then the opposite type of caster has a massive disadvantage.
#13 Jan 22 2004 at 11:03 AM Rating: Default
Thank you Dyzalot. That is one of the posts I was referring to. I personally have had a much changed opinion about str. I did some eyeballing to see what effect it has on my war. I fought for half of an ldon with no Str buffs then fought the other half at max str. Unbuffed I am at about 160. It seemed to me that I was dealing significantly more damage per hit, even if I wasn't hitting more often.
#14 Jan 22 2004 at 11:06 AM Rating: Decent
Quote:
Dex: Adds to archery and melee to-hit ability


Dexterity has no proven effect on melee to-hit ability.
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